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Genesis 8 Female in Poser

Ken1171

Wise
Contributing Artist
This week I've got commissioned to create dozens of morphs for G8F, but she seems incompatible with CR2 Exporter. I can't be sure, but it looks like she has 2 bones (bend and twist) per group in some body parts, which breaks the Poser rigging mold. I use the Morphing Tool and magnets to create the morphs, and that's why I need it to load in Poser. This has worked with all Genesis versions until now.

When I load the exported CR2 in Poser, all these parts that have multiple bones per group are not loaded. They show in the hierarchy, but there is no geometry associated. I have marked some of these joints with red in the image below. The exported OBJ has all the parts intact, so it's the CR2 that gets broken.

I wonder if there is a way around this? Or have we reached that dreadful day when DAZ finally managed to make a figure that is utterly incompatible with Poser? I would appreciate any feedback on this.

Genesis8Groups.jpg
 

Ken1171

Wise
Contributing Artist
After further testing, I've noticed I can work with the raw OBJ in Poser to create the morphs, and when exported, Poser will NOT break the OBJ because it's not rigged. It keeps all the groups intact, and the geometry as Unimesh. It can be imported straight from Morph Loader Pro, which is way better than having to use the Transfer Utility to project vertexes from one mesh to another.

For handling JCMs, I have to first pose the figure in DS, export to OBJ, and again work with raw mesh in Poser. I haven't tried JCMs yet, but everything indicates it should work fine, since Morph Loader Pro can handle JCMs with posed MTs (morph targets).

This method makes it possible to create morphs for Genesis 8 in Poser, no matter what kinds of new rigging DAZ comes up with, and the resulting MTs are directly compatible with Morph Loader Pro. :)
 

Pendraia

Seasoned
Contributing Artist
Are you making morphs for Poser or DS? I'm surprised that you're working in Poser if they're for DS, wouldn't have thought that anyone has a working method yet for getting it into Poser at this point as it's only just been released.
 

Ken1171

Wise
Contributing Artist
G8F doesn't work in Poser, so it's all for DS. However, DS doesn't have any tools for morph creation or even editing, so I do all the work in Poser with the Morphing Tool and magnets. Have been doing so since Genesis 1, 2, and 3 for private commissions, and I already got work to do with Genesis 8 and Victoria 8. The raw OBJ method works very well, and it's actually easier and faster than what I was doing before. As an added bonus, this method doesn't depend on whatever is the rigging used the figures, so it works fine even of Genesis 8. Have finished most of the morphs already. ^^
 

Pendraia

Seasoned
Contributing Artist
Seems like a lot of work to do it that way...I would have just used Zbrush or whatever model you use.
 

Lissa_xyz

I break polygons.
Just remember that G8's eyelashes are a separate figure and not to export them (they're parented to G8 by default). You'll get a vert mismatch error if you try to reimport a morph with the eyelash figure present.

With regards to how you're doing it, I'm with Pen. lol
 
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Ken1171

Wise
Contributing Artist
Seems like a lot of work to do it that way...I would have just used Zbrush or whatever model you use.

I use ZBrush for some things, but not for others. This commission job includes making toenails longer, and I have vertex-level precision with the Morphing Tool and magnets in Poser. This also allows me to save the magnets to the library and reapply them if I need to do changes later on. ZBrush has no precision for this kind of editing, where I need to move 1 vertex, but not the next row, which are all sitting very close to each other. I also need to split some of the morphs into left and right sides, which is hard to do in ZBrush, but very simple in Poser. :)

Just remember that G8's eyelashes are a separate figure and not to export them (they're parented to G8 by default). You'll get a vert mismatch error if you try to reimport a morph with the eyelash figure present.

Haha too late - I have lost an hour trying to figure out why I was getting vertex mismatch, until I realized the eyelashes were being exported along! I have learned this the hard way! ^___^

With regards to how you're doing it, I'm with Pen. lol

There are pros and cons. I have a hard time trying to morph a toe, but not the ones next to it, and they are basically touching each other. ZB can't pick the vertexes I want, and I can't even SEE vertexes in ZB. Even the topological move brush ends up picking the other toes, and it's too much work to mask each toe. It just lacks the precision I need at vertex-level. Poser offers that level of control, and it also makes it easy to split morphs into left and right sides. There is also the fact that Poser supports my 3D mouse, and ZB doesn't. I am used to the way ZB navigates in 3D, but it never feels natural to me. Some jobs are great with ZB, but not this one. ^^
 

eclark1894

Renowned
I'm a novice at morph creation, and frankly I suck at it so I don't usually try, but if all you need is to get a G8 Obj file into poser so you can work on it, could you export G8 into ZBrush as an Obj, then export that object into Poser? I'm just saying, that if Poser and Studio aren't playing nice together, don't waste your time trying to make them. Go around them.
 

Lissa_xyz

I break polygons.
@Ken1171 You know Zbrush has masking functions, right? Mask out the bit you want to adjust and invert the mask so that everything except what you want to move is frozen.

@mininessie Daz has something called d-formers. Very much a pain to use and not worth the hassle to use them to create morphs.

@eclark1894 Using Zbrush as a go-between would just be an extra un-necessary step. Exporting an OBJ gets rid of the rigging and such already. It's only because he initially used the CR2 exporter that it kept them intact.
 
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mininessie

Dances with Bees
Contributing Artist
me? no...i am talking about d-formers...and then you can put them in the tab...but making them first with d-formers
 

Lissa_xyz

I break polygons.
Oh, yea. I mean you "can" use them, but they're a lot more cumbersome and time consuming than just using a proper sculpting tool.
 

mininessie

Dances with Bees
Contributing Artist
you can export too to hexagon and then reimport as morph...but i still need to learn to use better hexagon
 

Ken1171

Wise
Contributing Artist
Just to clarify - CR2 Exporter breaks the CR2, but the OBJ is still good to use for morphs. Of course, we can also export just the OBJ, which is what I am doing now. D-formers are not enough to do what I do, especially when DS can't use weight maps with them like we do in Poser to get individual vertex control. Besides, D-formers have serious bugs that have never been fixed, so it's a pain to work with, and it's easy to loose all your work.

I use a combination of magnets with weight maps, and the Morphing Tool, which is almost like ZBrush inside Poser. It's more convenient than ZBrush because I can save magnets to the library, and reapply them to another morph without having to start from scratch if I want to expand, modify, or create variants of the same shape. Also, magnets do not modify the geometry until you commit or export a morph target, so I can change my mind at any time, and also combine multiple magnets with individual, localized control over the whole. Can't do any of that with ZB. The Morphing Tool can add and remove symmetry at any time, recreating or deleting the other side whenever I need, which is not possible with ZB. If you forgot to enable symmetry in ZB, you have to start over. If you used symmetry and want to split the morph into left only or right only, there is no simple way to do it. In ZB I find myself spending more time fighting masks than doing the job. It depends a lot on the task in hands. If magnets and the Morphing Tool can do it faster, I won't think twice. If not, I switch to ZB. :)

Don't take me wrong, I love ZB, but the tools I have in Poser are specific for the kinds of tasks we use in Poser/DS. There is also the fact that I am more productive in Poser because I can use my 3D mouse, while ZB will probably never support it.
 

Miss B

Drawing Life 1 Pixel at a Time
CV-BEE
Just to clarify - CR2 Exporter breaks the CR2, but the OBJ is still good to use for morphs.
I've been under the impression that DUF products don't have OBJs. If they did, I'd get some of them and import them (mostly clothing) for use in Poser.
 

Ken1171

Wise
Contributing Artist
I've been under the impression that DUF products don't have OBJs. If they did, I'd get some of them and import them (mostly clothing) for use in Poser.

That's correct - DAZ doesn't use standard OBJs like Poser does. It uses a proprietary format only usable in DS. But all DS products were created from OBJs - it's just DS that chose not to use standard formats. Nonetheless, you can always export models back to OBJ using File->Export->OBJ if that's what you want. You can also export to CR2, and it will convert the rigging and give you a new OBJ. Doesn't work with G3F or G8F, though. There is a way to get G3F into Poser, but not the new G8F because the new grouping is incompatible.
 

Miss B

Drawing Life 1 Pixel at a Time
CV-BEE
Oh yes, I'm fully aware of exporting an OBJ to use in Poser. My issue is, I don't have a version of DS 4 later than 4.0 Pro, so I can't load up any DUF items to export.

I just think it's unfortunate that vendors who create for newer versions of DS (other than DAZ3D's products) don't include their original OBJs in their zip. I've often found products created for software I don't use (like Vue or Carrara) that include the OBJs, and I can use them in Poser or earlier versions of DS, though those are usually props or environment sets rather than clothing.
 

Ken1171

Wise
Contributing Artist
I just think it's unfortunate that vendors who create for newer versions of DS (other than DAZ3D's products) don't include their original OBJs in their zip.

That's just not part of the DS culture. DAZ has always used proprietary formats. It's 2 different cultures. Poser got extremely popular because it used standard file formats, and DS because it's given away for free. That's basically what sets them apart - the mentality behind the companies.
 
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