carmen indorato
Extraordinary
Yeah i miss those days too. and kids who played outside smelled great too ozone and kiddie sweat instead of nacho chips and musty couch pillows! Where did we go wrong losing those good ole days!?
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I Just Wanted to Post an Image Thread
- Thread starter Stezza
- Start date
carmen indorato
Extraordinary
Another nice image. Like the next one I love the set. Can't get enough of good sets. Can I ask what it is...same as the next one?
carmen indorato
Extraordinary
carmen indorato
Extraordinary
I agree......to a limit.I once wrote an article about art being something that produces an emotional response on people, and it was highly criticized by the community at DeviantArt. Some people understood that if their galleries don't get much attention, my definition would mean that they are bad artists, or that what they do is not art. The truth is that nobody can define art without someone getting hurt. In addition, movie studios spend hundreds of millions to make a film that ends up flopping, because nobody could predict people's reaction to it. Art is undefinable, and people's reactions to it are purely subjective. It cannot be qualified or quantified. I just make art for myself, and if other people come to like it, it's pure chance. Don't sweat over it.
If you create art for your "SELF" it is fine and dandy. But if you are a working professional and I define PROFESSIONAL as someone who Makes a Living creating art that is a totally different thing opening up much more complex issues to address. Especially if you have not made a name for yourself. If no one likes your work them what do you do?
carmen indorato
Extraordinary
See it as art as a deviation from life as opposed to a deviation of life. Not necessarily deviant but going off on a different tangent especially when we live vicariously through our art and especially when viewers live vicariously through the art visions of others.
quietrob
Extraordinary
The name (Deviant Art) may seem an unfortunate choice of words but a deviant is defined as something out of the norm or noncomformist. Strangely enough a lot of the artist don't like 3D art as it doesn't conform to what they think is their idea of art. Time has rendered (pun) this notion as an antiquated idea. While TV does use traditional 3d art, every movie that is considered animated is now using 3D art. Even older ones such as Mulan mixed 3D with standard animation for the shots involving thousands of people. I suspect that many of these traditional artists are furious that some of their talents can be replaced with a software program. I started in the military and then switched to pure Electronics in my everyday life. It was no fun to be replaced by a machine as technology advanced.
Yet nothing can replace practice with any art form. Composition, lighting, color choice all count when creating an art piece and that doesn't change with 3D. Anyone here knows that they cringe when they see their artwork from when they first started to what they could achieve several years later. On a positive note regarding trational artists, when I was putting together my comic, the guy who at the time drew Superman, commented on my comic and told me to keep up the good work. I've found the greater the artist, the kinder they are. I've contacted several professional comic book artists that draw for DC and Marvel and without exception, they are the kindest group of people I've met.
Not unlike those here. Noncomformists, we may be but most great artists are.
Another comic page. Send me a PM if you think I should conform and only post renders.
Page 24
Yet nothing can replace practice with any art form. Composition, lighting, color choice all count when creating an art piece and that doesn't change with 3D. Anyone here knows that they cringe when they see their artwork from when they first started to what they could achieve several years later. On a positive note regarding trational artists, when I was putting together my comic, the guy who at the time drew Superman, commented on my comic and told me to keep up the good work. I've found the greater the artist, the kinder they are. I've contacted several professional comic book artists that draw for DC and Marvel and without exception, they are the kindest group of people I've met.
Not unlike those here. Noncomformists, we may be but most great artists are.
Another comic page. Send me a PM if you think I should conform and only post renders.
Page 24
@carmen indorato That was what my article was claiming, and it got some people enraged. I claimed art (to be art) MUST cause an impression on people - be it a good or a "bad" one. There is a lot of people who never got any reaction from the public, so by association, they understood I have claimed what they do is not art. As for the "bad" reaction, I mean (for example) things that may look dark, disgusting, and/or morbid like the works of H.R. Giger. His morbid bio-mechanical designs have caused a huge impact on the artistic community all over the world (I am a big fan). Giger style implies "beauty" on things that defy the notion of beauty.
Conversely, some artists emphasize on the erotic side, and can call a lot of attention to themselves, and somehow I consider this as "cheating". I wrote another article just about this. If page hits mean "good art", then going erotic can multiply the numbers pretty quickly - and yet mean nothing. But if page hits are not a reliable source for how much "reaction" art causes on the public, then what does? Anybody familiar with 3D knows that dressing a character takes much more work than a nude, but yet, nudes get more page hits in many cases. Some artists fall for that bait, because it offers a much better chance of causing a "reaction" on people - hence it could be considered "cheating".
Just food for thought. ^^
I remember reading an article from Disney Animation Studios, where a lot of traditional artists were either fired, or relocated to another task after Disney decided to give in to 3D, which they publicly claimed they never would. But times have changed, and the cost of traditionally drawn animation has become too time-consuming and expensive for nowadays standards. In Japan, where traditional animation has a much wider public comparing to the rest of the world. 3D is slowly getting into the framework, mostly motivated by the economic crisis in the country that has been rolling for decades. They had to cut costs, and the average salary of an Anime studio animator these days turns around 13K a year - some of the lowest in the country.
I remember some of these artists claiming that learning 3D nowadays is not a choice, but a matter of survival in the industry. Animation is not the only field where things like this can happen. In IT, programming languages show up and die all the time, and those who have long tern experience with them can suddenly find themselves experts in something that no longer exists. Happened to me many times over the years.
nDelphi
Admirable
This is my second attempt at a knight from middle earth. This time it is of a Númenórean Knight.
"Númenor was the kingdom of the Dúnedain, located on an island in the Great Sea, between Middle-earth and Aman. The land was brought up from the sea as a gift to Men. It was also called Elenna or the Isle of Elenna ("Starwards") because the Dúnedain were led to it by the star of Eärendil, and because the island was in the shape of a five-pointed star."
"Númenor was the kingdom of the Dúnedain, located on an island in the Great Sea, between Middle-earth and Aman. The land was brought up from the sea as a gift to Men. It was also called Elenna or the Isle of Elenna ("Starwards") because the Dúnedain were led to it by the star of Eärendil, and because the island was in the shape of a five-pointed star."
carmen indorato
Extraordinary
So let me get this straight if I say I do erotic fantasy art you believe I am cheating because setting up and creating images of naked women or men is cheating and I am therefore less of an artist than I would be if I dressed my "Barbi Dolls" to the Nines for my work?
Well let me narrow this belief down to the basic common denominator.
I was a traditional pen and ink, airbrush and water color artist. I also did Cell art...not animation...but Cell Art the same way Disney artists created their images just Still framed. I was a photographer and film maker, Graphic designer and art director and Associate Producer of a tv dance show that won an ACE Award nomination for best locally aired Cable TV show in Upstate NY). I was a jeweler and leather craftsman, wood worker and metal smith (Made a full size Conan Broad Sword out of unhardened band steel, wood brass and leather) and have a pending TM for a buckle free leather belt, one size fits most.
I was a professional graphic designer who won several AD awards in my area and proudly so.
So, was I an artist. YES. I felt like one and lived like one and thought and breathed it all for many years....without having 2 nickels to rub together for any one length of time.
I grew old, and bitter and angry and frustrated and finally realized I needed to grow the hell up and "GET A JOB" to save enough money for my rapidly approaching old age. I did what the Poem DESIDERATA told me for so many years to do: I SET ALL THINGS OF YOUTH ASIDE and moved on. When I computerized I felt a part of me being torn away. I have been doing computer imaging now for 23 years.
Am I still an artist.
NO!
When I computerized my MUSE must've gotten royally pissed off and left me to fend for myself. All the years of honing my skills and perceived width and breadth of varied talents were almost instantly blown away. NO more photography, no pen and ink, no more air brushing or jewelry making. I miss the darkroom where I would spend hours or days carefully making silver halide prints, or sepia toned or selenium toned prints, or gold chloride prints or the smell of linseed oil when hand coloring photos. I miss making films. I miss the smell of wood, cut and sanded and the seductive sheen of polished steel and the feel of a Mill Bastard rasp filing away unneeded metal to bring it down to shape. I miss the sweet sheen of silver and the smell of solder when putting jewelry together. I miss the feel of wet clay when building coil or slab ceramic figurines or containers. I miss photographing young women, in various states of undress and then getting praise from those looking at their images calling it beautiful art (and yes I miss that most of all!)
My Poser stuff is not art anymore. It is a facsimile of art taking the place of my erotic and fine art nude photography which as I stated I miss most. I do not create the models or the textures, I do not create the plants and props and clothes and other accessories.
Any more now than I did as a photographer. I did not create the models then or their hair or their clothes or skin variances. I did not create the scenes I posed and photographed them in either. Yet I considered the end results there as art but not my Poser work.
I consider it ILLUSTRATION which i have always considered, along with Graphic Design, a tool for selling products, services or ideas.
I do consider my Poser work as a means to relaxed introspection and carry over obsession of ideas from my past,where the creative process is to just do it as best as I know how but never good enough. It is a way of sublimating my life in all its lackings and frustrations and losses and pains and fears that have built up all these years.
Basically it something to do.
Chris and the other content creators here are the real Artist. Not me.
SO though I do create images that fit somewhat the subject matter I have always pursued, I am not really an artist anymore...by my standards. Yet like I loved when people responded positively to my analog work I also respond in kind when people respond to my digital/Poser offerings even if I do no longer consider it art. Page hits mean nothing but when someone stops browsing and downloading my stuff from the varied sites it might be posted on to comment I appreciate it and love their effort to make me feel positive about what little imaging I still do. and I do almost exclusively EROTIC FANTASY ART! Am I really cheating?
NO!
I just prefer seeing things brought down to their least common denominator: NAKED like GOD made us. And if no one likes it or if everyone loves it, whether I get thousands of page hits or not is irrelevant. What is relevant is how I feel about it and once in a while what even one person stops by to tell me he/she feels good about it. That is good enough for me. I don't think any of that is CHEATING but feeding my obsession (Or what I used to call my MUSE)!
@carmen indorato Those are all very good points, but there are other sides to the story. Back in 2003 I used to run a gallery at Rosity, and I used to post some nudes once in a while. What happened was that at some point, people would no longer comment on my non-nude posts, and that was depressing. The nudes were the same quality as anything else I was posting, but only they would get attention. As an experiment, I started to post more nudes, and my page hits exploded. I've got over a million in less than 3 years, but I wasn't happy about it. I ended up closing that gallery and starting over at DA, where I only rarely post any nudes.
I have evolved as an artist at DA, thanks to interactions with artists from all kinds of medias and styles. I have produced over a hundred collab works with the community over there, and there was so much to learn from other non-3D medias. Their feedback has been invaluable to me. However, I have been there for over 10 years, and I am just approaching 600K page hits - because I quit doing nudes. Still today, in the rare occasions when I post nudes (or partial nudes), these works tend to get many times more attention than my regular works, and that is really sad. I like depicting sexy stylized pinups, but I [personally] believe nudity is greatly overrated. I think that dressing sexy has way more impact and the same [or better] effect.
I want to keep my days of posting nudes behind me, even when there is considerable pressure from the community, especially from those who remember me from Rosity. But for every nude I post, it depreciates everything else I do in my gallery - it shows in the page hits and comments. This is where my notion that nudes are like "cheating" comes from. It's a different experience from yours, so I wanted to put it in context. Quite so often I have to hear people telling me that I could be way more "popular" if I posted more nudes, as if I didn't know that from Rosity. That's not the kind of attention I want to get. From my experience at Rosity, it was quite an empty kind of fame. I now get way less attention, but at least I know it's sincere.
As for the other subject - creating your own models, that is also quite overrated. As you know, I create a LOT of the contents you see in my renders, but that doesn't make me more of an artist than other people. Creating fully functional models is an art on its own right. But good scene lighting and texture painting are also forms of art that require time, effort, and talent to get right. However, I have never been praised for the good job on my work on the rigging or UV mapping. Those are both very challenging things that take years to get right. Nonetheless, most people only think of the modeling, as if it were the beginning and the end of it all. Even though I didn't create Dawn, I rarely use her as she comes. I create my own morphs and body types for my characters and renders, and they look *nothing* like Dawn. The art is not on what base models with start a scene with, but what we do with them and the final result. In the same way, Poser is just a tool - art is how we use it to reach the final results.
A good example of that is when people used to "accuse" me of using models created by other people. That's some of the most empty kinds of critique, and let me show you why. When I finally posted scenes where I had created EVERYTHING from scratch on my own, people didn't think any better of it - they just took it for granted. This just proves that they never cared who created the models in the first place. It's just an excuse to complain and feel better about themselves. Even for those who cared to critique my models, they still have nothing to say of the rigging, UV mapping, and all other parts of the process. I personally think that there are many cases where rigging is way more challenging than just modeling. I usually model in a matter of hours, and then spend DAYS on the rigging. Nonetheless, those who seem to care about who created the models never comment on the rigging - because in reality most of them don't know what's involved in the process, and therefore are not qualified to critique in the first place.
For those who still insist that 3D is not art - just go watch an animated feature movie. They are all 3D nowadays, and there is no magic "make art" button. Wait until the credits start scrolling, and look at how many artists from different areas are needed to make a 3D movie. Hundreds, sometimes thousands, and only half a dozens of those are modelers (for those who believe 3D only takes a modeler). Disney has developed most of the art theory (e.g, animation principles and color theory) lectured in art schools nowadays, and they make 3D movies. If what they do is not art, then nothing else could qualify. Here again, the art is not on the models, but instead what is done with them. For instance, Pixar are experts in making us completely forget that the movie is made of 3D models. That's art on its finest.
I have evolved as an artist at DA, thanks to interactions with artists from all kinds of medias and styles. I have produced over a hundred collab works with the community over there, and there was so much to learn from other non-3D medias. Their feedback has been invaluable to me. However, I have been there for over 10 years, and I am just approaching 600K page hits - because I quit doing nudes. Still today, in the rare occasions when I post nudes (or partial nudes), these works tend to get many times more attention than my regular works, and that is really sad. I like depicting sexy stylized pinups, but I [personally] believe nudity is greatly overrated. I think that dressing sexy has way more impact and the same [or better] effect.
I want to keep my days of posting nudes behind me, even when there is considerable pressure from the community, especially from those who remember me from Rosity. But for every nude I post, it depreciates everything else I do in my gallery - it shows in the page hits and comments. This is where my notion that nudes are like "cheating" comes from. It's a different experience from yours, so I wanted to put it in context. Quite so often I have to hear people telling me that I could be way more "popular" if I posted more nudes, as if I didn't know that from Rosity. That's not the kind of attention I want to get. From my experience at Rosity, it was quite an empty kind of fame. I now get way less attention, but at least I know it's sincere.
As for the other subject - creating your own models, that is also quite overrated. As you know, I create a LOT of the contents you see in my renders, but that doesn't make me more of an artist than other people. Creating fully functional models is an art on its own right. But good scene lighting and texture painting are also forms of art that require time, effort, and talent to get right. However, I have never been praised for the good job on my work on the rigging or UV mapping. Those are both very challenging things that take years to get right. Nonetheless, most people only think of the modeling, as if it were the beginning and the end of it all. Even though I didn't create Dawn, I rarely use her as she comes. I create my own morphs and body types for my characters and renders, and they look *nothing* like Dawn. The art is not on what base models with start a scene with, but what we do with them and the final result. In the same way, Poser is just a tool - art is how we use it to reach the final results.
A good example of that is when people used to "accuse" me of using models created by other people. That's some of the most empty kinds of critique, and let me show you why. When I finally posted scenes where I had created EVERYTHING from scratch on my own, people didn't think any better of it - they just took it for granted. This just proves that they never cared who created the models in the first place. It's just an excuse to complain and feel better about themselves. Even for those who cared to critique my models, they still have nothing to say of the rigging, UV mapping, and all other parts of the process. I personally think that there are many cases where rigging is way more challenging than just modeling. I usually model in a matter of hours, and then spend DAYS on the rigging. Nonetheless, those who seem to care about who created the models never comment on the rigging - because in reality most of them don't know what's involved in the process, and therefore are not qualified to critique in the first place.
For those who still insist that 3D is not art - just go watch an animated feature movie. They are all 3D nowadays, and there is no magic "make art" button. Wait until the credits start scrolling, and look at how many artists from different areas are needed to make a 3D movie. Hundreds, sometimes thousands, and only half a dozens of those are modelers (for those who believe 3D only takes a modeler). Disney has developed most of the art theory (e.g, animation principles and color theory) lectured in art schools nowadays, and they make 3D movies. If what they do is not art, then nothing else could qualify. Here again, the art is not on the models, but instead what is done with them. For instance, Pixar are experts in making us completely forget that the movie is made of 3D models. That's art on its finest.
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Hornet3d
Wise
Some very long and interesting submissions and I am fascinated by the different points of view. I don't think that it is ever possible to define art, let alone good or bad art, and often what is imagined to been the mind of the artist is very different to the thoughts of the creator but I am not sure that matters. For example, if I read a book my imagination be used heavily to create the characters, true the author can use their skills to decide whether we love of hate them along with other such traits but the total character I picture is bound to be different from the one imagined by the author. There are very few books that I start reading and do not finish but I can finish a book and decide that it was not my sort of book. That does not make the author any less skillful and probably just means I am not on the same wavelength.
I don't do nudes as a rule but that does not mean I see nudes as any less worthy, many have had a lot of post work done to make the bends look real, maybe less so with weight mapping, but they are still not easy. I also know from my photography days lighting a naked body well is extremely difficult. I do understand that they get more hits when posted so if hits are your goal, nudes are the way to go. I too used to have a gallery at Rendo, which has long since bit the dust, and now the only place I really upload renders is here at Hivewire, the reasons really are twofold. Firstly I hope it adds in someway to promoting the popularity of Dawn and the rest of the Hivewire family, and the second reason is because I know that the people who comment on, and like renders, are people who understand the process and can make a valued statement on a render, good or bad. I would rather have one Hivewire like on a render someone thought was good that a 100 likes on a render just because it centers on nude characters. Does that mean I think a nude render is worthless, well I suppose it depends to some degree on whether the artist's aim was to create art or generate a load of likes. As I have no way of knowing which is true I give every nude render the benefit of the doubt and see it as render as good or as bad as any other. I suppose there is also an element that I do not regard myself skilled enough judge another's work, but f I like something I say so in the hope it will encourage the artist in question to produce more and continue to develop my art.
Not trying to argue with anyone here, just trying to add my very personal view to the mix.
I don't do nudes as a rule but that does not mean I see nudes as any less worthy, many have had a lot of post work done to make the bends look real, maybe less so with weight mapping, but they are still not easy. I also know from my photography days lighting a naked body well is extremely difficult. I do understand that they get more hits when posted so if hits are your goal, nudes are the way to go. I too used to have a gallery at Rendo, which has long since bit the dust, and now the only place I really upload renders is here at Hivewire, the reasons really are twofold. Firstly I hope it adds in someway to promoting the popularity of Dawn and the rest of the Hivewire family, and the second reason is because I know that the people who comment on, and like renders, are people who understand the process and can make a valued statement on a render, good or bad. I would rather have one Hivewire like on a render someone thought was good that a 100 likes on a render just because it centers on nude characters. Does that mean I think a nude render is worthless, well I suppose it depends to some degree on whether the artist's aim was to create art or generate a load of likes. As I have no way of knowing which is true I give every nude render the benefit of the doubt and see it as render as good or as bad as any other. I suppose there is also an element that I do not regard myself skilled enough judge another's work, but f I like something I say so in the hope it will encourage the artist in question to produce more and continue to develop my art.
Not trying to argue with anyone here, just trying to add my very personal view to the mix.
VortigensBane
Busy Bee
Still playing with LAMH, hair shaders, and "Mutations," but there were so many wishlisted dragon breeds on sale recently that they somehow joined the mix...
Summoning the Elements
View media item 2955
Summoning the Elements
View media item 2955
Hornet3d
Wise
Simply stunning ........ as usual.
carmen indorato
Extraordinary
I loathe the idea of having taken this thread hostage with this contentious topic though in reading all our points...all valid BTW....i sort of feel that it is ALL right. What I walk away with here is we post images on the sites that give us the most feed back for our work. I post on sites that ALLOW my images to be posted. I would love to say I don't care much anymore about comments though it is nice getting them. Because i stopped chasing the almighty dollar and thus praise for my work a long time ago praise or criticism have become more irrelevant to me of late. I do it for myseIf that means fewer comments which is the case at Deviant as it was the case at my Renderosity site (which, like you both, I have NOT posted new images on for many years BECAUSE of their TOS and not because of lack of comments.
Posting images where the final image is key a site where the majority of the viewers are Poser users one can surmise that that majority know sheitz about modeling or rigging...I don't mean conceptually but hands on KNOWING. So obviously you are not going to get any respect for all the modeling and rigging work you do even before the render. If on the other hand you post your work a a site like CG Works or whatever it is called where everyone there works in MAYA or other modeling/rigging apps where they have NO respect for Poser users you will get a lot more respect. It is true Birds of a Feather Fly Together.
I have been into Erotic art since 4th grade in some fashion or another in ALL the medium I have worked in even jewelry making.
So if I post images it will NOT be here where that kind of image or subject matter is forbidden or appreciated by the majority. As a guest here I respect the TOS despite the fact it frustrates me. I look for sites where members appreciate my genre. Those re the site where you might get the most kudos for what you produce. It is therefore all contextual. Sell a product service or idea where you biggest consumer might be hungry to buy(comment/appreciate) or more easily induced to buy (comment/appreciate) and avoid those sites where there exists no market. A simple marketing principle.
Posting images where the final image is key a site where the majority of the viewers are Poser users one can surmise that that majority know sheitz about modeling or rigging...I don't mean conceptually but hands on KNOWING. So obviously you are not going to get any respect for all the modeling and rigging work you do even before the render. If on the other hand you post your work a a site like CG Works or whatever it is called where everyone there works in MAYA or other modeling/rigging apps where they have NO respect for Poser users you will get a lot more respect. It is true Birds of a Feather Fly Together.
I have been into Erotic art since 4th grade in some fashion or another in ALL the medium I have worked in even jewelry making.
So if I post images it will NOT be here where that kind of image or subject matter is forbidden or appreciated by the majority. As a guest here I respect the TOS despite the fact it frustrates me. I look for sites where members appreciate my genre. Those re the site where you might get the most kudos for what you produce. It is therefore all contextual. Sell a product service or idea where you biggest consumer might be hungry to buy(comment/appreciate) or more easily induced to buy (comment/appreciate) and avoid those sites where there exists no market. A simple marketing principle.
Hornet3d
Wise
I have nothing against Erotic art but at the same time I fully understand and support the TOS here at Hivewire as it adds another option for people. As it stands those that want to look for Erotic art can find it easily and those that don't, for whatever reason, have a place to come. In some cases they may even be the same people who's requirements may be time or relocation related.
Yes it was the TOS that stopped me posting at Renderosity and I deleted the whole gallery, almost 200 images if I remember rightly, about two years ago now. My reason posting there were similar to here in that I almost always linked my renders to the product used in the hope it would drum up more support for the vendors. Unfortunately, it was the Powers That Be that put an end to all that.
Yes it was the TOS that stopped me posting at Renderosity and I deleted the whole gallery, almost 200 images if I remember rightly, about two years ago now. My reason posting there were similar to here in that I almost always linked my renders to the product used in the hope it would drum up more support for the vendors. Unfortunately, it was the Powers That Be that put an end to all that.
carmen indorato
Extraordinary
unfortunately sites that cater to that genre are becoming fewer and even some of the sites that have dedicated to it are starting to get hassled by their ISPs and more conservative patrons to tone things down o cease and desist.
oh well!
BTW sorry everyone an especially Chris for hijacking this thread with contentious and unrelated discourse.
...and i crawl back into the shadows!
oh well!
BTW sorry everyone an especially Chris for hijacking this thread with contentious and unrelated discourse.
...and i crawl back into the shadows!
Hornet3d
Wise
unfortunately sites that cater to that genre are becoming fewer and even some of the sites that have dedicated to it are starting to get hassled by their ISPs and more conservative patrons to tone things down o cease and desist.
oh well!
BTW sorry everyone an especially Chris for hijacking this thread with contentious and unrelated discourse.
...and i crawl back into the shadows!
It is a shame to hear that but I suspect it is part of a wider issue as it appears political correctness is something quite strong in the world we now live in.
As for hijacking, I think most threads of this length meander at times and while I cannot speak for the Hivewire team in my experience they are very good at moving something to it's own thread if they see a need.
carmen indorato
Extraordinary
There are fewer things I HATE with all my being is the mamby-pamby, saccharin mouthed, hypocritical BS Political/Social Correctness going on in our world today. I am Sicilian first gen and I learned culturally to call a spade a spade no matter what. As I have gotten older to waylay useless battles I now prefer to ignore certain teases but all in all I prefer standing for my beliefs and doing/saying what is right.
Of course with the loss of T.R.U.T.H. as we know it or desperately need it to be in our complex world what do we really argue about? Nobody seems to know any more. Personal truths are the New reality. What we each believe really do not justify wars....of any kin. But when we rely on others to give us what we need or want that gets in the way of personal happiness and success.
Like the Chinese say:
"We need to bend like a willow in the wind!"
Love it VB. Setting the elements up as dragons is inspired.