RELEASED Anime Dawn Begins!!

[eclark1894]

I think I prefer a morph as well. As long as the clothes contain the morphs.

 

[Ken1171]

Most if not all the folks here in these forums have found a HiveWire figure that works for them. I love that. It reaffirms my faith in humanity from time to time to see that people can be open and try things new to their liking. I appreciate all of you that are here, chiming in and helping move things forward in a big way!!!

I took a HUGE leap of faith when I decided to adopt Dawn back in 2013, a few months before this site opened up. I have used V4 for many years, and had quite a bit invested on her in my runtime. Like it was said earlier here, it's not that V4 was such a great figure on her own, but instead that she had a lot of support from the community. To me Dawn is the opposite - she is a great figure on her own, but didn't get as much support from the community. But I am still using Dawn almost exclusively in my renders nonetheless, because she IS a great figure on her own, while V4 is not. Even though I have so much contents for V4, I no longer feel compelled to place her in my scenes because now I am spoiled with something better. For those who deny themselves the chance to play with Dawn, it's their loss.

Now back to the subject - I vote for Dawnime as a morph, as means to add value to to Dawn and turn more heads towards her.

 

[Lorraine]

No opinion on the anime as I'm not going to be a user but...

If you want more people who use DS to use Dawn, Dusk and Luna you need to provide them with certain basics that DS users will expect to be there.the first things that come to mind are clones and projection templates for weight mapping.

This x 100! If I may be blunt, projection templates should come with the figures upon launch. Daz has accustomed buyers to expect this and if we want those peeps to come over here our figures should have these toot sweet and straight away. Dusk has been out for forever and still has none which as a male figure has not been so bad, but Luna needs a skirt and dress projection template, and Dawn STILL doesn't have a dress template. Shove these up the to do list and get a !!!

 

[JOdel]

And I definitely like the idea of clones. Now that these figures have built up some support I should think it would be a real draw for Studio users to have them able to wear each other's clothing. I rather don't think that you want people to get the impression that these figures are only really supported in Poser. That would drive Studio users away fairly quickly.

 

[CajunBeauty]

I would love to have the Dawn and Dusk clones as well!!

 

[eclark1894]

And I definitely like the idea of clones. Now that these figures have built up some support I should think it would be a real draw for Studio users to have them able to wear each other's clothing. I rather don't think that you want people to get the impression that these figures are only really supported in Poser. That would drive Studio users away fairly quickly.

It's actually funny to me that you say that. I've always gotten the impression that Dawn was really into geared to be more supportive of Studio users, precisely BECAUSE they had more competion in that area. That and, again, just my impression, mind you, seems to me most of the people who post here regularly seem to be primarily Studio users. Just goes to show that perception is in the eye of the beholder.

 

[3dOutlaw]

Thanks for letting me know. I wish there was something that can be done so I can use other clothing, hair ,etc. on Dawn, Dusk and Luna without violating the EULA. I tried auto fit with Daz, but it always comes up as unsupported when I trying to use anything other than what was actually made for Dawn. The available content for these characters or should I say the lack of is most likely one of the things that's keeping these figures from really taking off. I hear it over and over from those who use 3D figures that having alot of content to use is a big factor when they decide to invest in buying a figure.

I believe you can dial your own clones for personal use without breaking any rules, you just can't distribute/provide them, isn't that correct? If not, I better take down my post on how to do it -> LINK

Using that, and a smoothing/collisiong modifier, and you can use a lot of old stuff!

 

[Britt]

If Anime Dawn is as superb as I imagine she will be; people will have no complaints forking over the money for Dawn!

 

[Pendraia]

Actually I would say it's probably about 50/50 here in terms of forum users...we have also a lot of people who are happy to give both programs a go though also. I used to think the same as Jodel at one point that there was more support for Poser content. I think that's changing a bit though with more people on both sides willing to either team up or learn the new software. An example of this is AetherDream used to do just Poser but now does both(which I really appreciate as I love your characters AD).

3DOutlaw, it's okay to make your own there just seems to be an issue with distributing clones for other companies characters. I believe your tutorial is fine.

I don't really understand though why products like Evil Innocence's Crossdresser is okay but clones aren't...

 

[3dOutlaw]

Instead of clones, here is a simple script that will auto-convert your Daz figure clothes and hair to Dawn. Took a little while, but I think it works pretty good, and you avoid the EULA police! ;-)

LINK

 

[Pendraia]

Dang, you sort of caught me...it's actually the 2nd where I am and very early!

 

[JOdel]

I suspect that a lot of of the perception comes from where the Dawn and Co. products turned up. Until *very* recently most of the larger markets were all primarily Poser-oriented -- with the obvious exception of DAZ itself, and we'll be waiting a looooong time before we see anything for Dawn there.

But it really did seem to me that most of the earliest support (and certainly the earliest freebies) for the figure were nearly all Poser-based. Poser morphs, poser materials, poser rigging. And, for that matter, a lot of the name vendors who brought out early products for the figure were predominantly Poser vendors. Studio support caught up later, and it really does seem to be pretty evenly balanced now. But for the first six month or more I got into the habit of writing off the whole Dawn market because it looked like she was just yet another primarily Poser-oriented figure. Even though I knew that Dawn came in a Studio version. But if I couldn't use my existing Studio stuff with her, and all of her own stuff was for Poser, what was the point?

I was here primarily to watch the development of Harry!

Thinking it over; it took years for the Genesis series to catch on anywhere but on DAZ's own site. And that's probably largely because they focused so exclusively on Studio and Genesis that everything else rather went to the wall. (Including some of their own other products, like Cararra.) But one of the reasons that Genesis was so popular with the people who had access to it, is the fact that with the clones and projection templates, you really do have a fighting chance of using most of the clothing models produced for just about any other DAZ figure over the past decade+ (Plus selected non-DAZ figures, like Sadie) on Genesis.

With the Hivewire figures reaching a point that there are three basic figures, and we're on the point of seeing specialized variants of them with different shapes released, it really is getting well to the point that the Studio versions should ship with the clones to make their supporting products all inter-compatible with each other. Why leave Genesis with all the advantages?

 

[Ken1171]

From a content creator's perspective, making Poser or DS products is no longer just a matter of choice. After DAZ3D departed from Poser support, making products for one or the other has become a matter of making the products TWICE. By now, it has been years since these programs ceased to be compatible, and that falls over the shoulders of CAs. Whenever we hear about "converting" something to Poser or to DS, that is a misleading idea. Some things will work, and many will not, and it's a case by case situation, so rigging, morphs and materials will need to be reworked and adjusted, where in some cases it's easier (and maybe faster) to redo the whole thing from scratch. Quick conversions might be Ok for our personal projects, but definitely not for commercial products.

From the particular case of Poser CAs, things can get challenging since there is no easy or accessible way to learn DS4. Documentation for content creators is scarce and commonly outdated, and tools change without notice with every update and version, making even commercially purchased tutorials invalid quite quickly. This alone can hold up development for months, because at some point I either don't know how things work anymore, or I couldn't figure out how things work in some particular area. There is also the fact that the DAZ3D store forbids selling any products geared to HiveWire3D figures, even though products for their figures are sold here.

It's important to realize that this is not an equal opportunity market when it comes to DS products, or for Poser CAs to learn DS to make them. In my particular case, supporting DS in all my products has come with great personal sacrifice, and yet, DS versions still represent a tiny portion of my sales. In other words, in over 2 years, supporting DS still hasn't paid off. On one hand I see people claiming things seem to be evening up, while my sales stats are telling me the opposite.

If HiveWire3D figures will be geared more towards Poser or DS, that is completely up to the consumer. What they buy, and in what amounts is what will decide it in the end. If there is a substantial demand for DS support, there will be one. That's how things work.

 

[frogimus]

My vote is for a morph. A really good anime figure (with Dawn bundled somehow) will gain Dawn more traction.

And on the other subject, I use both and will tend to buy things that are available to both. But i'm only one user so that doesn't tip the scales much.

 

[sanbie]

I love Dawn and I love the anime look so no matter what I will be getting it lol

 

[eclark1894]

I suspect that a lot of of the perception comes from where the Dawn and Co. products turned up. Until *very* recently most of the larger markets were all primarily Poser-oriented -- with the obvious exception of DAZ itself, and we'll be waiting a looooong time before we see anything for Dawn there.

But it really did seem to me that most of the earliest support (and certainly the earliest freebies) for the figure were nearly all Poser-based. Poser morphs, poser materials, poser rigging. And, for that matter, a lot of the name vendors who brought out early products for the figure were predominantly Poser vendors. Studio support caught up later, and it really does seem to be pretty evenly balanced now. But for the first six month or more I got into the habit of writing off the whole Dawn market because it looked like she was just yet another primarily Poser-oriented figure. Even though I knew that Dawn came in a Studio version. But if I couldn't use my existing Studio stuff with her, and all of her own stuff was for Poser, what was the point?

I was here primarily to watch the development of Harry!

Thinking it over; it took years for the Genesis series to catch on anywhere but on DAZ's own site. And that's probably largely because they focused so exclusively on Studio and Genesis that everything else rather went to the wall. (Including some of their own other products, like Cararra.) But one of the reasons that Genesis was so popular with the people who had access to it, is the fact that with the clones and projection templates, you really do have a fighting chance of using most of the clothing models produced for just about any other DAZ figure over the past decade+ (Plus selected non-DAZ figures, like Sadie) on Genesis.

With the Hivewire figures reaching a point that there are three basic figures, and we're on the point of seeing specialized variants of them with different shapes released, it really is getting well to the point that the Studio versions should ship with the clones to make their supporting products all inter-compatible with each other. Why leave Genesis with all the advantages?

I actually agree about early out of the starting gate support for Dawn. Poser users were looking for a new figure and for many of them it wasn't going to be Genesis. It actually took me a while to get on the Dawn bandwagon. She sat in my runtime for almost a year and a half before I finally took the wrapping off her. (I actually have a dynamic Little Black dress on sale at CP for Roxie that has a morph in it to fit Dawn.) My support for Dawn has been more sporadic, but gradually she's lured me away from Roxie. (Well, not completely, but I'll always support the Poser natives.)

I would still prefer that Chris and Hivewire develop a closer relationship with SM/Poser, and make Dawn Poser's official figure, but I do also understand that Hivewire doesn't want to be seen as a Poser-only support store and alienate their Studio customer base the way DAZ has alienated their Poser base.

Sorry, I'm drifting off topic.

 

[JOdel]

Is it maybe time to consider a Dawn LE? With maybe an upgrade path to the full version?

I suspect it might be an administrative hassle, but it's a route that's been traveled before.

 

[CajunBeauty]

Daz support for me is key. Daz is the only program I know how to use and I have gotten good enough where I have very few problems now, because I know how to remedy most of the issues that come up and for me it takes a lot less time to create my renders in Daz than it would in Poser. I guess you can say that I am spoiled on the autofit function and the ease of switching back and forth with the tabs. And the Daz library setup is way easier for me to find all of my products and faster as well.

 

[Ken1171]

That might be a good idea - like releasing a free Dawn LE version. It could be like Dawn without morphs, like DAZ did with the Millennium figures. Even without any morphs, I can still do wonders with Dawn with just body scaling. As opposed to V4, Dawn is great even on her own. ^o^

 

[Pendraia]

There is also the fact that the DAZ3D store forbids selling any products geared to HiveWire3D figures, even though products for their figures are sold here.

Hey Ken, just curious as I've not seen anything from the company only from many users on this...do you know if they have actually knocked any back? I would have thought that it was unlikely that anyone had offered them there actually...

It's important to realize that this is not an equal opportunity market when it comes to DS products, or for Poser CAs to learn DS to make them. In my particular case, supporting DS in all my products has come with great personal sacrifice, and yet, DS versions still represent a tiny portion of my sales. In other words, in over 2 years, supporting DS still hasn't paid off. On one hand I see people claiming things seem to be evening up, while my sales stats are telling me the opposite.

I thought I said earlier that the users in the forum had evened up, but I'm also seeing a few more character and clothing creators who are doing both. Lully recently released a make up set for Dawn in DS and previously she has been Poser only items. Then again maybe I've just gotten better at converting between the two programs.
I've been at the other end of the spectrum and struggling to learn Poser and must admit it has taken me much longer to get Diva ready to submit as I want to do it for both programs.