eclark1894
Visionary
I thought that both Studio and Poser 11 provide a way to snap joints to match the shape now. Am I wrong?
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RELEASED Anime Dawn Begins!!
- Thread starter Chris
- Start date
Not sure. More of a question for Paul I suppose. We haven't looked around all the corners on this one yet.
CajunBeauty
Adventurous
I really like the idea of you keeping the same UVs and mesh and being able to use all of the old Dawn stuff with any of the new figures. I think staying on this path woth pay off big in the long run. I know this is one of the biggest complaints I see alot in the Daz forums and FB groups is hat when the new Genesis line comes out people have to start all over with content until the vendors start putting out all the conversion tools that can help to convert the older stuff to the newer stuff, but I still think that there are some people that isn't so interested in having to buy more things such as the conversion tools to use their existing products on the new figure. I know this is the one thing that made V4 so popular and why she is still alive today even though she is incredibly flawed and doesn't work very well out of the box sort of speak. Also if we also keep offering both DS and Poser support for all of the products I think that will pay off as well since I see Daz slowly fading out Poser support. The Daz and Runtime DNA merger may have giving a little more promise to the Poser folks, but I still see them phasing Poser out in the long run. I think they are just waiting until they get big enough and have enough people hooked on to their figures. I can foresee that move coming though.
In my opinion after working with Dawn that if we can get more content providers to bring in more content for Dawn I can easily see her being the next V4. I know as for myself I enjoy using SE more than V4 just for the simple fact is that she doesn't have the posing issues that V4 does and the SE Iray materials are really nice for them being base materials. I also think that if we create our figures with Iray as well as the new Poser Superfly materials that we will see more interest in them as well. I know that will increase the work load on creating content, but I think it would benefit us in the long run.
I also agree with Ken about adding more variety to Dawn and I would also like to see all of the spill over to Dusk as well. Dusk needs some Iray materials like Dawn SE. I know enough with Daz that I can do a half way decent conversion using the provided Iray Daz Uber shader, but many of the beginner 3D people may not know how to do that so offering more Iray mats will benefit them and most of the time those materials end up being better than what you can get from the conversion anyway. If we can get all of the content makers here to work together and put out content around themes then I can see us getting more of an upper hand of Daz. So basically in a nut shell keep improving Dawn and Dusk's bases, but keep it so that you can still use all of the older content on them the way they did with M4 and V4. And on top of that offer more content and variety in content, morphs and skin textures. I also think that making more universal clothing for Dawn and dusk would also benefit Hivewire as well. That's the main thing people like about the first Genesis line was that they could use all of the content available for Genesis on either the female or the male bases and their characters. I believe that if we work it this way that we can bring over all of the Daz customers that enjoyed the benefits of the older figures like M4, V4 and Genesis. I see alot of discontent for the Genesis 2 and 3 lines, because Daz moved away from the way they did their older characters which was purely a move to make their customers have to spend more money on content. That may be a smart business move in the short term, but I still think that it may backfire on them in the long haul.
If I had the computer, the tools, textures and the know how I would surely jump on board with increasing the content here. I really love Dawn more than V4.
Sorry about my numbers I hit something on my laptop keyboard and now the numbers type like this. I'm trying to figure out how to fix it. I'll never buy another Gateway again.
In my opinion after working with Dawn that if we can get more content providers to bring in more content for Dawn I can easily see her being the next V4. I know as for myself I enjoy using SE more than V4 just for the simple fact is that she doesn't have the posing issues that V4 does and the SE Iray materials are really nice for them being base materials. I also think that if we create our figures with Iray as well as the new Poser Superfly materials that we will see more interest in them as well. I know that will increase the work load on creating content, but I think it would benefit us in the long run.
I also agree with Ken about adding more variety to Dawn and I would also like to see all of the spill over to Dusk as well. Dusk needs some Iray materials like Dawn SE. I know enough with Daz that I can do a half way decent conversion using the provided Iray Daz Uber shader, but many of the beginner 3D people may not know how to do that so offering more Iray mats will benefit them and most of the time those materials end up being better than what you can get from the conversion anyway. If we can get all of the content makers here to work together and put out content around themes then I can see us getting more of an upper hand of Daz. So basically in a nut shell keep improving Dawn and Dusk's bases, but keep it so that you can still use all of the older content on them the way they did with M4 and V4. And on top of that offer more content and variety in content, morphs and skin textures. I also think that making more universal clothing for Dawn and dusk would also benefit Hivewire as well. That's the main thing people like about the first Genesis line was that they could use all of the content available for Genesis on either the female or the male bases and their characters. I believe that if we work it this way that we can bring over all of the Daz customers that enjoyed the benefits of the older figures like M4, V4 and Genesis. I see alot of discontent for the Genesis 2 and 3 lines, because Daz moved away from the way they did their older characters which was purely a move to make their customers have to spend more money on content. That may be a smart business move in the short term, but I still think that it may backfire on them in the long haul.
If I had the computer, the tools, textures and the know how I would surely jump on board with increasing the content here. I really love Dawn more than V4.
Sorry about my numbers I hit something on my laptop keyboard and now the numbers type like this. I'm trying to figure out how to fix it. I'll never buy another Gateway again.
It's font. 123456789
eclark1894
Visionary
Well, I do know that Poser allows a developer to teach a figure to adjust the joints to the shape. Chuck even posted a video of Andy changing shape on youtube.
paganeagle2001
Adventurous
I hope she comes with a dev suit\dress so content makers can start making things for her.
All the best.
Richard
All the best.
Richard
I actually got started with Poser because of MayaX's AnimeDoll back in 2004. For the next couple of years, that was the only figure I have used. When Aiko3 was released for free in 2005, I was the only remaining content creator still making outfits for AD, even when nobody was buying anymore. In his blog in Japan, MayaX eventually quoted me as his biggest supporter in America. I have a history with that figure. ^^
Poser does have a feature to automatically adjust joint centers to morph shapes, and that's new with Poser 11. Though in my experience, it didn't work out as expected in some cases. In critical areas such as the collars and thighs, even a slight offset can cause havoc, so I would do it manually to avoid surprises. I would leave the automatic adjusting for less critical areas such as knees, elbows and even the eyes. I guess it depends on the case. We have to remember that a real human figure's joints are more critical to offsets than a dummy like Andy, and that's probably why they used it for the demo.
Thinking about this some more and I have to say I would prefer to see her as morph for Dawn. To get her morphs to work on Dawn I think she would have to be loaded as a morph also so you could dial her in first and then add the morphs otherwise they would look different on Dawn.
If you want more people who use DS to use Dawn, Dusk and Luna you need to provide them with certain basics that DS users will expect to be there.the first things that come to mind are clones and projection templates for weight mapping.
These may seem like extras but they're not.
I have clones for the Hivewire figures and will be submitting the dawn ones as part of Diva, but at this point it wouldn't be worth submitting Dusk and Lunas until they get the templates.
These would also increase the content made for all the characters. There are many people who can create models but don't know the rigging. Good projection weight maps would go a long way towards this happening...my two cents fwiw.
CajunBeauty
Adventurous
V
I would also love to have clones for Dawn, Dusk and Luna so I can use the content I have for other figures that I have with Dawn, Dusk and Luna.
Yeah, I wouldn't use it. And it does violate our EULA. We've asked them to take it down.
CajunBeauty
Adventurous
Thanks for letting me know. I wish there was something that can be done so I can use other clothing, hair ,etc. on Dawn, Dusk and Luna without violating the EULA. I tried auto fit with Daz, but it always comes up as unsupported when I trying to use anything other than what was actually made for Dawn. The available content for these characters or should I say the lack of is most likely one of the things that's keeping these figures from really taking off. I hear it over and over from those who use 3D figures that having alot of content to use is a big factor when they decide to invest in buying a figure.
Just want to make clear that by clones I mean that I have clones that will allow Hivewire figures to use each other's clothing. For example Dawns clones allow her to wear clothes that were made for Dusk and Luna.
I also did a tutorial on how to create them which iirc is on the new site...but with no projection templates they use the models rigging to project the weight maps on to the item which isn't too bad for close fitting items but is no use for anything with a skirt. Even Dawns official ones need expanding as there are still items like hair that it would be useful to have them for.
I also did a tutorial on how to create them which iirc is on the new site...but with no projection templates they use the models rigging to project the weight maps on to the item which isn't too bad for close fitting items but is no use for anything with a skirt. Even Dawns official ones need expanding as there are still items like hair that it would be useful to have them for.
Chris,
I would also prefer Anime Dawn to be a Dawn morph rather than a stand alone figure. If I understand correctly, Dawn's current morph packs would work on Anime Dawn. But what about future morph packs? Wouldn't there need to be two versions of new morph packs ... one for Dawn and one for Anime Dawn? Or would we still be able to apply new morph packs to either figure?
I understand the pricing concern, since someone who might be interested in Anime Dawn might feel having to purchase Dawn and Anime Dawn is too expensive. I don't know if the store software can handle a conditional sale ... like if you buy Anime Dawn, you get a discount on Dawn. Or are coupons possible? Or ... maybe just a Dawn sale when Anime Dawn is released. Ultimately, I suppose input from someone who hasn't yet purchased Dawn but wants Anime Dawn might be helpful.
I'm just concerned that having Anime Dawn as a separate figure might lessen the versatility of Dawn and Anime Dawn down the road.
I would also prefer Anime Dawn to be a Dawn morph rather than a stand alone figure. If I understand correctly, Dawn's current morph packs would work on Anime Dawn. But what about future morph packs? Wouldn't there need to be two versions of new morph packs ... one for Dawn and one for Anime Dawn? Or would we still be able to apply new morph packs to either figure?
I understand the pricing concern, since someone who might be interested in Anime Dawn might feel having to purchase Dawn and Anime Dawn is too expensive. I don't know if the store software can handle a conditional sale ... like if you buy Anime Dawn, you get a discount on Dawn. Or are coupons possible? Or ... maybe just a Dawn sale when Anime Dawn is released. Ultimately, I suppose input from someone who hasn't yet purchased Dawn but wants Anime Dawn might be helpful.
I'm just concerned that having Anime Dawn as a separate figure might lessen the versatility of Dawn and Anime Dawn down the road.
eclark1894
Visionary
I don't want to de-rail this thread, but I'm not a DS user. Heck, Pen knows I've just managed to find and save poses in DS. So I have no idea what a "clone" is or does, or why it violates HW's Eula. You guys are talking way above my head here.
CajunBeauty
Adventurous
I am assuming from what I read that the morphs created would work on both Dawn and Anime Dawn. I would like to see her be a standalone so it would be easier on our customer's wallets. Not everyone, even if interested in both, can afford to buy both. They do this alot of Daz and I constantly hear alot of complaining when they come out with a new line of figures, because the customers almost have to start all over with the content if they want to move on to the next line of figures. I think making standalones that will be able to use each other's morphs, clothing, hair, props,etc. would give Hivewire an edge on Daz. I can see more people being attracted to our products.
@eclark1894 , sorry Earl...a clone is what allows the autofit to fit clothing from one figure to another. It means that I can take Dusk's clothing apply it to Dawn and use it with her. Hope it's alright to post this here...here's Dawn in an outfit made for Dusk that I used a clone and autofit to convert it for her to use. It's Ken's western outfit sold here.
The dusk clone that allows this to work will be part of Diva.
Edited to add...Hivewire can't provide clones of Daz Characters as it would be against eula and vice versa...
The dusk clone that allows this to work will be part of Diva.
Edited to add...Hivewire can't provide clones of Daz Characters as it would be against eula and vice versa...
There seems to be some confusion around how morphs would work between Dawn and the stand alone Anime version, and also how future morphs would work out for CAs. I think people would have a better idea of which version they would like better if those things were clarified beforehand.
1. How would Dawn morphs work with Dawnime? I assume the stand alone version would still be Dawn, but the Anime morph would be hardcoded to default to "1" on the CR2 and DUF files.
2. If the above is correct, and the Dawnime stand alone figure would still be Dawn with a FBM hardcoded as the default shape, then CAs would NOT have to create special versions of their morphs or outfits for it. The only difference would be that CAs would also have to include support for the Dawnime shape as an extra FBM, which on its own is nothing much different from the usual workflow.
If the above assumption is correct, then Dawnime could also exist as a morph injection preset (INJ/REM files), so people who already have Dawn won't have to use her as a separate figure, and still benefit from mix and matching all their existing morphs with it. This would please both sides with no compromises.
@eclark1894 I am also not very familiar with clones, but if you are a Poser user, chances are you don't have to worry about it, since AFAIK Poser doesn't support it.
1. How would Dawn morphs work with Dawnime? I assume the stand alone version would still be Dawn, but the Anime morph would be hardcoded to default to "1" on the CR2 and DUF files.
2. If the above is correct, and the Dawnime stand alone figure would still be Dawn with a FBM hardcoded as the default shape, then CAs would NOT have to create special versions of their morphs or outfits for it. The only difference would be that CAs would also have to include support for the Dawnime shape as an extra FBM, which on its own is nothing much different from the usual workflow.
If the above assumption is correct, then Dawnime could also exist as a morph injection preset (INJ/REM files), so people who already have Dawn won't have to use her as a separate figure, and still benefit from mix and matching all their existing morphs with it. This would please both sides with no compromises.
@eclark1894 I am also not very familiar with clones, but if you are a Poser user, chances are you don't have to worry about it, since AFAIK Poser doesn't support it.
Great opinions being shared here for sure. You folks are closest to us and your thoughts matter most. Been rethinking this now, and perhaps we'll lean again toward this character as a morph on Dawn. What Satira is saying is true, and we'd thought the same, that is, we can have a sale on Dawn to bundle them together or whatever to make it easier for folks to purchase Dawnine.
What Ken said earlier adds strength to this as a morph too. Folks who don't purchase products with us may not still shop with us just because we have an anime character now. No big deal to them right? There's several other anime figures to fit there needs with tons of support already.
I just wanted peeps to be able to get in on this without a barrier of purchasing Dawn. I guess that was my primary concern anyway. Plus the fact that many think Dawn is dead and won't give her a second or third look, or they go by what someone else is telling them without really giving her a spin on their own. Much like politics or religion, folks form strong opinions and just don't or can't look at things with an open mind sometimes. But... but, look at Cajun Beauty, she's now playing with Dawn S.E. and loving her! She's saying things like "we" as being inclusive as supporting us, and being us, and that she is one of us, and indeed she is!
Most if not all the folks here in these forums have found a HiveWire figure that works for them. I love that. It reaffirms my faith in humanity from time to time to see that people can be open and try things new to their liking. I appreciate all of you that are here, chiming in and helping move things forward in a big way!!!
Lisa is currently busy putting products on sale for our April Showers products for tomorrow, and when she gets more time I've asked her (in our skype meeting today) to dip in here and digest what's being said so we can make a decision on this matter of stand alone vs morph. So until that happens, we won't be deciding, plus I think it's good to carry this conversation on thru the weekend to see what other input we collect here.
What Ken said earlier adds strength to this as a morph too. Folks who don't purchase products with us may not still shop with us just because we have an anime character now. No big deal to them right? There's several other anime figures to fit there needs with tons of support already.
I just wanted peeps to be able to get in on this without a barrier of purchasing Dawn. I guess that was my primary concern anyway. Plus the fact that many think Dawn is dead and won't give her a second or third look, or they go by what someone else is telling them without really giving her a spin on their own. Much like politics or religion, folks form strong opinions and just don't or can't look at things with an open mind sometimes. But... but, look at Cajun Beauty, she's now playing with Dawn S.E. and loving her! She's saying things like "we" as being inclusive as supporting us, and being us, and that she is one of us, and indeed she is!
Most if not all the folks here in these forums have found a HiveWire figure that works for them. I love that. It reaffirms my faith in humanity from time to time to see that people can be open and try things new to their liking. I appreciate all of you that are here, chiming in and helping move things forward in a big way!!!
Lisa is currently busy putting products on sale for our April Showers products for tomorrow, and when she gets more time I've asked her (in our skype meeting today) to dip in here and digest what's being said so we can make a decision on this matter of stand alone vs morph. So until that happens, we won't be deciding, plus I think it's good to carry this conversation on thru the weekend to see what other input we collect here.
I like more the idea of her being a morph.