Poser sold to Rendo

[AnimaGemini]

No kidding! The simplest way to explain what the problem is to the regular user is this: the figure OBJ you export from Poser is DIFFERENT from the original one in the Geometries folder. Poser changes it, breaking each body group into separate, split geometry, so the vertex count is now different from the original. This has a wide range of ramifications:

* Every morph you export from Poser has a different vertex count from the original geometry. This makes Poser morphs incompatible with all other programs, even DAZ Studio.
* All OBJs auto-created by Poser are different from the original we first imported into Poser, no longer being Unimesh. These broken OBJs should never be used in commercial products.
* Rendering in external rendering engines (Octane, Lux, etc) may end up with holes between body groups because they are not welded.
* All figures exported to OBJ from Poser have split (broken) UVs, so those cannot be edited anymore.
* All figures exported to OBJ from Poser have split (broken) geometry, so editing them in external programs may open holes between the body groups since they are not welded.
* This also affects all of the Poser Fusion plugins, where all exported figures will have split groups with unwelded seams. These seams may show as artifacts in renders.
* The seams between groups may explode when edited with the Morphing Tool when the figure is posed. This happens because the Morphing Tool was designed assuming the geometry is Unimesh, but Poser doesn't support that. There is a workaround, but the issue itself cannot be fixed.
* We can sometimes see artifacts between body groups and textures in Poser renders because the figures have split groups with unwelded vertices. This affects both geometry and UV maps. We can resolve this by converting the figure skinning to "Unimesh" (Poser 11 only), even without subdivision.

This is a short version of a much longer list I have posted at SMS, but those issues alone are serious enough for concern. I first realized this when trying to create the JCMs for my "Superhero" outfit for Dawn, where the Morphing Tool ended up destroying the model instead of morphing it. That ended up delaying the product release for months. It had no solution in Poser 10, and was only "resolved" in Poser 11 in one of the many SRs with a workaround. Larry told me the only way to really fix this would be to rewrite Poser from scratch, but I doubt they would ever do it. LadyLittleFox has written at one of her paid tutorials that this was a major reason why she quit Poser and switched to DS. There was no solution in Poser 10, and she couldn't finish her product.

That was unacceptable, and to me, it still is. The workaround for editing or creating JCMs adds more work, making the process cumbersome. And again, it may never be fixed. Chances are the brand new Poser 12 will come out with the same decade-old broken core.

@Ken, and yes this.
My last attempt to try to create and outfit with JCM's in Poser, just wanna make me cry. Dusk's Plague Doctor outfit. It is a very complex outfit and in Poser i had more back slash than anything else with it. Now i do it in Daz studio and it is way more easy. Morphs can be transferred without destroying the whole mesh and without a huge amount of workaround.
Also buildings, Poser had problems with sharp edges and the UV seams. Rendered with black plotches very often. Had to remodel many times the building and work with tricks on the UV.
This was also a big deal breaker for me.

 

[Ken1171]

@Ken, and yes this.
My last attempt to try to create and outfit with JCM's in Poser, just wanna make me cry. Dusk's Plague Doctor outfit. It is a very complex outfit and in Poser i had more back slash than anything else with it. Now i do it in Daz studio and it is way more easy. Morphs can be transferred without destroying the whole mesh and without a huge amount of workaround.
Also buildings, Poser had problems with sharp edges and the UV seams. Rendered with black plotches very often. Had to remodel many times the building and work with tricks on the UV.
This was also a big deal breaker for me.

At least there is a workaround for JCMs now. I don't like it, but it's better than nothing. DS has nothing to edit geometry with, so we have to use external tools like zBrush. I prefer to deal with the workarounds in Poser because it is still faster than having to use external tools. What saves me here is that Dawn has only a couple of JCMs, so it's rather quick to handle them. However, with figures with lots of JCMs like LaFemme, it becomes impractical.

I also used to remodel props with hard edges to make them render correctly in Poser, but nowadays I just adjust the smoothing groups, or disable smoothing altogether for the prop, so hard surfaces remain sharp. The only exception to this rule is when you want to be able to subdivide your prop, for then it will turn into a mushy ball if the hard edges are not protected.

 

[Snarlygribbly]

Ken, can you remind me what that workaround is?

 

[Glitterati3D]

Ken, can you remind me what that workaround is?

Not Ken, but the workaround is designating pre-Transform or post-Transform on the JCMs. It's a checkbox.

 

[DanaTA]

At least there is a workaround for JCMs now. I don't like it, but it's better than nothing. DS has nothing to edit geometry with, so we have to use external tools like zBrush.
...

Actually, DAZ Studio has a tool called Geometry Editor. I don't know if it does what you're talking about, I haven't used it...yet.

Dana

 

[3WC]

Actually, DAZ Studio has a tool called Geometry Editor. I don't know if it does what you're talking about, I haven't used it...yet.

Dana

That is more for hiding or deleting geometry, not so much moving vertices around to make morphs.

 

[DanaTA]

OK.

Dana

 

[Ken1171]

Ken, can you remind me what that workaround is?

The workaround involves switching the CR2 channels order. In Poser, this defines if the morph will be applied before or after the joint is bent. They call this as "pre-transform" and "post-transform" for short. Technically speaking, this places the JCM morph channel before or after the translation channels. Before the workaround, we had to manually move the channels, edit the morph, and then move them back. It was insane!!!

With Larry's workaround, Poser now automates the channels moving, but we still have to remember switching the order before and after editing or posing the figure with a JCM, or else the morph is ruined. We cannot edit JCMs without posing the figure, so you can imagine this can be quite some workload on top of the actual work. We only need to do this because Poser doesn't support Unimesh geometry on rigged figures.

To switch channels order, right-click the JCM you want to edit, and the last 2 options on the bottom automate the moving for you, but you have to remember doing it EACH time, before and after posing/editing, or else...

Not Ken, but the workaround is designating pre-Transform or post-Transform on the JCMs. It's a checkbox.

It's not a checkbox. It's a set of 2 separate commands that automate the channel reordering task.

Actually, DAZ Studio has a tool called Geometry Editor. I don't know if it does what you're talking about, I haven't used it...yet.
Dana

That is correct. DAZ Studio allows face selections with this tool, but we cannot do anything to them besides selecting. This is the equivalent to Poser's "Grouping Tool", which does exactly the same thing.

 

[Dragonsegg]

so when I try to access Poser 11 it says that maximum number of activations for this license has been exceeded even though I haven't used PP11 in over 2 years. I still have my serial number so how do I get access or am I just screwed because I didn't use it for a long time?

 

[Miss B]

Have you updated to the newest version? That might help you get it back to working again.

 

[KageRyu]

so when I try to access Poser 11 it says that maximum number of activations for this license has been exceeded even though I haven't used PP11 in over 2 years. I still have my serial number so how do I get access or am I just screwed because I didn't use it for a long time?

If you are still running a non-rendo version of Poser 11 it will likely have license issues because SM's license server is no longer active. If you are experiencing this problem trying to download or install the new version from Renderosity I would suggest reaching out to Jenn Blake via Renderosity either using site mail or through the store contacts, and she should be able to help sort out the issue.
How long it has been since last usage should not invalidate your license.

 

[Ken1171]

so when I try to access Poser 11 it says that maximum number of activations for this license has been exceeded even though I haven't used PP11 in over 2 years. I still have my serial number so how do I get access or am I just screwed because I didn't use it for a long time?

First thing you need to check is what version you have installed. If it's anything below 11.2.xxxx, then you need to go to Renderosity, download and install the 11.2 update, and then your license should activate again. The update will ask if you want to uninstall Poser 11, but you don't have to. It will proceed with the update if you say no.

Hope this helps.

 

[Satira Capriccio]

The Poser download is available at Poser - 3D Rendering & Animation Software

 

[eclark1894]

First thing you need to check is what version you have installed. If it's anything below 11.2.xxxx, then you need to go to Renderosity, download and install the 11.2 update, and then your license should activate again. The update will ask if you want to uninstall Poser 11, but you don't have to. It will proceed with the update if you say no.

Hope this helps.

The update never asked me if I wanted to uninstall. I just ran the installer. No fuss, no muss. Haven't upgrade to 11.2.289 yet though because everything's working fine for me now.

 

[Hornet3d]

so when I try to access Poser 11 it says that maximum number of activations for this license has been exceeded even though I haven't used PP11 in over 2 years. I still have my serial number so how do I get access or am I just screwed because I didn't use it for a long time?

If you are still running a non-rendo version of Poser 11 it will likely have license issues because SM's license server is no longer active. If you are experiencing this problem trying to download or install the new version from Renderosity I would suggest reaching out to Jenn Blake via Renderosity either using site mail or through the store contacts, and she should be able to help sort out the issue.
How long it has been since last usage should not invalidate your license.

Clearly the first thing to do is download 11.2 as suggested by others but I think it is important to note this is another down fall of the activation feature, very important if Rendo decide to retain this feature but run it off their servers. The activations are not time limited so, as has already been stated, serial numbers should not become invalid over time, the exception being if Poser has been sold as in this case. The fact that the activationas are not time limited is the problem it itself.

SM were always very reluctant to advertise this feature and when they were forced to give details they did not stress the fact that, while you could have three versions running, deactivation is important and if you did not know that you could hit the limit. Even if you did know there were circumstances where deactivation was necessary this was not always possible. Imagine you have a version running on you computer and all is well until the day you turn it on and the computer will not start and needs to be replaced. You buy a new computer and install Poser and activate it, it seems fine but you have now used two of your three activations because you needed to deactivate the previous install which you could not do. Now life really is being unkind to you and the new computer fails. The company do what they should do and replace it and you install Poser again now all three of your activations are used. If you later try to add Poser to say a laptop using the same serial number you will get the message that the maximum number of activations have been reached which, then at least, meant the help of SM tech support to deactivate some of the installations.

I am not sure what information was passed from SM to Rendo, clearly the serial numbers were shared but was the state of present activations also shared... who knows. I have read some where over at Redo that the number of activations have been increased but exact details were not given.

I do hope in time that Rendo will do one of two things, scrap this horrible feature completely or find a better way to do it. In either case I hope they are clear on what the policy is and how it affects users. They have a lot on their plate at the moment but they have been good at disseminating information in most aspects of the new ownership. In due course I hope they will prove they can out do SM on the implementation and documentation on this feature, it is a very low bar they need to step over.

 

[Satira Capriccio]

Oddly enough, not even Smith Micro customer service seemed to understood the deactivation process. I ran into the activation limit this year after installing a new Hard Drive when the old one (third time) had to have the OS and all applications reinstalled. Instead, I replaced it with an SSD. I was very clear SM needed to reactivate my license as the previous installs had been on hard drives that were no more. The initial response was a joke and just instructed me I needed to enter my license key exactly as it appeared. I sure thought I'd been clear when I'd stated in the support ticket I'd already activated my Poser 11 license three times because of previous hard drive failures where I'd not been able to ever deactivate the license.

The rep kept insisting deactivation could ONLY be done within the program and was not something SM could do, and I simply needed to delete the C:\ProgramData\Poser\11 folder (which I did not do). In between emails my copy of Poser was reactivated. I don't know if his solution would have worked, but it appeared someone at Smith Micro knew they actually could do something about a license that was out of activations.

Not sure how they expect someone to deactivate a copy of Poser when a hard drive is dead.

Of course after I notified Customer Support they could close the ticket as Poser 11 finally was activated, the response instructed me that if I ever ran into the problem again, not to delete anything until after I'd contacted Customer Support. Which would lead me to believe that deleting that folder may have done nothing.

I doubt the activation limit will ever be removed. But hopefully, Bondware will understand sometimes we simply cannot deactivate a license and that there needs to be a quick and easy way for us to reactivate a license in the case of hard drive failures. Of course, even better would be if hard drives never failed or never needed to be rebuilt.

 

[Hornet3d]

Oddly enough, not even Smith Micro customer service seemed to understood the deactivation process. I ran into the activation limit this year after installing a new Hard Drive when the old one (third time) had to have the OS and all applications reinstalled. Instead, I replaced it with an SSD. I was very clear SM needed to reactivate my license as the previous installs had been on hard drives that were no more. The initial response was a joke and just instructed me I needed to enter my license key exactly as it appeared. I sure thought I'd been clear when I'd stated in the support ticket I'd already activated my Poser 11 license three times because of previous hard drive failures where I'd not been able to ever deactivate the license.

The rep kept insisting deactivation could ONLY be done within the program and was not something SM could do, and I simply needed to delete the C:\ProgramData\Poser\11 folder (which I did not do). In between emails my copy of Poser was reactivated. I don't know if his solution would have worked, but it appeared someone at Smith Micro knew they actually could do something about a license that was out of activations.

Not sure how they expect someone to deactivate a copy of Poser when a hard drive is dead.

Of course after I notified Customer Support they could close the ticket as Poser 11 finally was activated, the response instructed me that if I ever ran into the problem again, not to delete anything until after I'd contacted Customer Support. Which would lead me to believe that deleting that folder may have done nothing.

I doubt the activation limit will ever be removed. But hopefully, Bondware will understand sometimes we simply cannot deactivate a license and that there needs to be a quick and easy way for us to reactivate a license in the case of hard drive failures. Of course, even better would be if hard drives never failed or never needed to be rebuilt.

You were not the only one with this problem and the often lack of real response from SM, at least in the initial stages. I understand that the limit may need to remain but surely people involved in computer generated art are very aware the computers and hard drives fail, often with little or no warning. All that is required is the ability for Poser users to deactivate online in a reliable manner. I say reliable because SM belatedly supplied such a facility but often it still needed the assistance of SM tech support to deactivate anything thus defeating the whole object of the online facility.

It was just another example of how this feature was seemingly designed on a fag packet by individuals who did not understand the implications and then slipped into Game Dev and later upgrades by a marketing team that appeared to not know or care that the feature existed.

 

[esha]

hopefully, Bondware will understand sometimes we simply cannot deactivate a license and that there needs to be a quick and easy way for us to reactivate a license in the case of hard drive failures

They will, eventually, if enough people badger them to re-activate their licenses. Some previous versions of ZB required a ticket to custom support if you lost your hard drive (or simply forgot to deactivate before re-installing the OS). For some time now it has been possible to do that on your own, without the need to contact support.
Features that make life easier for the company are usually implemented rather quickly

 

[Miss B]

In case anyone hasn't been watching the download page, there's new updates dated 10-03-2019 at 12:10pm.

 

[Ken1171]

Geez, I am having so many crashes with Poser 11.2. It used to be so stable, and now it crashes by doing the simplest things, like editing a morph with the Morphing Tool, or just loading an asset from the library. When it freezes up for a few seconds, I already know it's going to crash. Frankly, I haven't seen Poser crashing this much in years. >___<