I wish we had..for Dawn

[Varnayrah]

This is great, quite what I was thinking of, it would only need detail and the panier shape thing... - pretty please could someone do more with it? I'd offer textures ;D

 

[Hornet3d]

I have to say that I am just not doing much 3D lately as I'm so thoroughly depressed with the recent threads berating the work of vendors (not at Hivewire, and not any of my products) to the point of petty, nitpicking by customers. Very publicly.

I'm beginning to feel like it's impossible to give customers what they want and you'll be berated for even attempting to do so.

I understand the desire to opt out when this happens but it is such a shame when the whole community loose the input from talented people just because a few ill mannered people decide to 'liven' up a forum for some perverse pleasure.

 

[eclark1894]

There is an alternative. Do the reverse. When we make dresses for the cloth room normally, it is with the intent of letting the gravity in the cloth room pull down on the dress. Normally, to do that we lower the fold resistance to make the dress droop easier. So if we set the fold resistance higher than usual, the dress does not readily drape and will hold the original shape.

 

[eclark1894]

Dawn's overskirt has a high fold resistance in this one so it will keep it's original shape, even if I lower the fold resistance to the underskirt to zero. At least, it should...

 

[spearcarrier]

What is VWD

Visual World Dynamics. Folks love it. I don't get along with it. I've already bashed it elsewhere so will let the VWD lovers have their space. LOL

If you know what you're doing, the optitex plugin works well. I use it all of the time. I've got to where I prefer it over conforming clothing.

I'm not sure why having buttons on anything makes it difficult. I admit in DAZ this means they'd probably bend. I don't carrreee. I also cheer for the idea of more Native American things - and I *don't* mean from Wild West. Being native american, it would warm my heart to see some things from the northern coast.

 

[Hornet3d]

Visual World Dynamics. Folks love it. I don't get along with it. I've already bashed it elsewhere so will let the VWD lovers have their space. LOL

If you know what you're doing, the optitex plugin works well. I use it all of the time. I've got to where I prefer it over conforming clothing.

I'm not sure why having buttons on anything makes it difficult. I admit in DAZ this means they'd probably bend. I don't carrreee. I also cheer for the idea of more Native American things - and I *don't* mean from Wild West. Being native american, it would warm my heart to see some things from the northern coast.

I can't comment on VWD as I only use Poser, although you don't appear to be alone in having difficulty. That said, I am a recent convert to dynamics and I know that it is still avoided by many users Poser users.

I agree with you view on Native American things but then there is so much that Dawn could use and there is unfortunately only a small band of vendors making for Dawn. Thankfully they are a skillful bunch so I can use almost all they create. I know Dawn can use a clothing from other figures, with a little conversion, and that is an option I often use but it is not to everyone's taste. Dynamics would help as the vendor could cover off multiple figures but for that to work the artist needs to be happy with the clothing method irrespective of what base software is being used.

 

[Gadget Girl]

I'm not sure why having buttons on anything makes it difficult. I admit in DAZ this means they'd probably bend. I don't carrreee.

Things like button's bending is part of the problem, although at least in Poser it's fairly easy to solve, since Poser has things called soft and rigid decorated groups to handle just this. The bigger thing, is that you have to make sure they are welded to the main geometry of the outfit so they don't fall off. It's hardly an undoable thing, but it does take some more effort on the modeler's part since they can't just be geometry touching the outfit, but actually a part of it (totally doable, it's just an extra step).

I also cheer for the idea of more Native American things - and I *don't* mean from Wild West. Being native american, it would warm my heart to see some things from the northern coast.

Do you have any images of the sort of stuff you are looking for? So many pages out there conflate all Native American tribes and cultures, that if you aren't already familiar with what you are looking for it's easy get things wrong. And being from the 'Wild West' myself I'm far more familiar with tribes like the Comanche and Arapahoe.

 

[spearcarrier]

With DAZ you can set the object to resist bending, sheer, be super heavy, and have high friction. I've noticed when I set all of that to maximum I can manage to get a semi stiff collar. The problem? Gravity from there. Yes, that old Newton thing. I have small hopes that the new owners of the dynamics engine will see poser's superiority in that respect, listen to the plethora of complaints over the years, and *fix it*. One of the first things I ever made dynamic was one of Littlefox's toon hairs in poser. I was able to get it to move around like I wanted without having to worry about, well, too much gravity. Sigh.

I have somewhere in my library a dynamic object with welded on buttons. The buttons are objects that share vertices with the shirt part with faces in a diamond pattern. Very neatly done.

As for pictures. Hrm! Without looking and off the top of my head: There's the Cherokee Tear dress, of course: it's probably the 2nd most popular on the powwow circuit, although I can tell you if you're not careful the further north you go the more you're likely to face regalia snobs. But don't get me started on social politics.

The jingle dress: it's basically a t-shape dress with cones all over it similar to the fringe from a flapper's dress. Or rather that's how it started. Actually now that I think about it, the two are very similar.

My own people and a lot of Northern tribes closer to the Great Lakes had shoes very similar to shoes worn by tribes in Russia. (looks for images) Culture and Costumes - Chippewa/Ojibwe for Ojibwe. See the black dress beaded with flowers? Forget 3D. I want for myself.

For jingle dresses there are a LOT of different styles. They're medicine... also regalia is a highly personal thing. YOu make it yourself, and there are people who *think* they're uniform... but they're not supposed to be. So rather than inundate you with jingle dresses of a thousand colors here's a cutie: http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lulxqb4OwA1r2e91wo1_500.png But if you wanted to attempt one of those I recommend you look at all the different styles because jingles can differ, too. They started out as rolled caps to snuff cans.

Here's an old dude from my tribe, sorta. https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipe...e/Lester_Skeesuk.jpg/150px-Lester_Skeesuk.jpg

The Cherokee, when they were more northern, wore cloaks made of owl feathers and had headdresses that looked like round tubes of feathers. Women sometimes wore their breasts bare.

Pocahontas came from the Pamunkey tribe. I only know that because I looked it up. The images I found for that are convoluted.

Someone who wanted to get away from the Wild West and be accurate would need to find tribal names and look up each tribe. We didn't exactly have a tartan system like Scotland to tell clans apart, but we did tend to identify according to what clothes we wore. This is why Blackfeet, Flatheads, Objibwe, etc etc. You would also have to be careful. In the old days, when my father was young, it was the thing to get dressed like the wild west and parade around because that's what tourists expected and you were trying to make a living. Also, the distrust was higher so a lot of Indian Bullsh*t was seen thrown around. Fortunately there are some brave men who took photographs on tribal lands and were true to them, and those photos are public domain. When it comes to pulling images off the powwow circuit, if someone is wearing say a Jingle dress you'll want to find the dress's history. The jingle dress is nationwide and there is some argument on where it started but most people will tell you it's a Lakota thing. The Cherokee Tear dress is referring to the trail of Tears. Etc.

I could probably take the Aiko Sunshine dynamic set and turn that into regalia for a Creek woman; they dressed like that. But with quillwork and beads of course. =^-^=

Didn't mean to lecture. I shut up now.

 

[spearcarrier]

Now that my mind is churning, a lot of dresses could be made using the morphing fantasy dress. Not all. But a lot.

 

[RAMWolff]

@Hornet3d VWD was made for Poser. The bridge was created just for DS and one for Carrara.

 

[Glitterati3D]

For jingle dresses there are a LOT of different styles. They're medicine... also regalia is a highly personal thing. YOu make it yourself, and there are people who *think* they're uniform... but they're not supposed to be. So rather than inundate you with jingle dresses of a thousand colors here's a cutie: http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lulxqb4OwA1r2e91wo1_500.png But if you wanted to attempt one of those I recommend you look at all the different styles because jingles can differ, too. They started out as rolled caps to snuff cans.

The problem with modeling a dress like this is polygon count. I once did a simple shawl with a single row of fringe on the bottom and ended up with over 100,000 polygons just in the fringe. That's too poly heavy to be useful in our hobby.

 

[Gadget Girl]

Thanks for the links. I'm bookmarking that for later. Not that I don't have a hundred potential projects floating around in my head, but you never know what will take precedence.

The problem with modeling a dress like this is polygon count. I once did a simple shawl with a single row of fringe on the bottom and ended up with over 100,000 polygons just in the fringe. That's too poly heavy to be useful in our hobby.

I wonder if the way to do it would be to partner with a really good texture artist. Instead of making the tassels many little polygons, make them basically a few polygons hanging down, and then with things like transparency maps, make them look like tassels, much like hair is usually done.

 

[Glitterati3D]

I wonder if the way to do it would be to partner with a really good texture artist. Instead of making the tassels many little polygons, make them basically a few polygons hanging down, and then with things like transparency maps, make them look like tassels, much like hair is usually done.

Yes, that's 3 strips for the tassles (made like hair), very low poly and low poly beads at the top of the fringe. I even reduced the amount of fringe to every other point trying to get to a reasonable poly count and still couldn't do it.

 

[Hornet3d]

@Hornet3d VWD was made for Poser. The bridge was created just for DS and one for Carrara.

Thanks for the clarification, I am fairly new to dynamics so a lot of this is new to me.

 

[Zaarin]

The problem with modeling a dress like this is polygon count. I once did a simple shawl with a single row of fringe on the bottom and ended up with over 100,000 polygons just in the fringe. That's too poly heavy to be useful in our hobby.

I've always wondered why there weren't more tasseled dynamic clothing (which always look so ugly on conforming clothes), but that would explain it.

 

[spearcarrier]

The problem with modeling a dress like this is polygon count. I once did a simple shawl with a single row of fringe on the bottom and ended up with over 100,000 polygons just in the fringe. That's too poly heavy to be useful in our hobby.
]

I admit, it's a bit more than a hobby for me.

But why couldn't the fringe have a lower count? Inquiring novices wanna know. That object looks so lovely. I'd buy it.

Edit: I have to wonder if a computer could handle the object these days. I use some pretty high count objects myself.

I wonder if the way to do it would be to partner with a really good texture artist. Instead of making the tassels many little polygons, make them basically a few polygons hanging down, and then with things like transparency maps, make them look like tassels, much like hair is usually done.

I used texture as a cheat to make a powwow shawl once: the optitex one. You can still find the texture over at sharecg. So yeah it could be done, but the fringe wouldn't fall correctly.
Fringe for shawls is also very long in some cases. I mean. Very long. Mine is 2 feet. and it was modest at the time.

EDIT: Another thing is if you look, fringe isn't as popular on traditional clothing as all that. That powwow dress of my dreams is a simple medieval tunic style dress with beadwork. Oh, the beadwork. The idea won't leave me alone. I think I'm going to end up trying to texture one before the year is out.

 

[Glitterati3D]

I admit, it's a bit more than a hobby for me.

But why couldn't the fringe have a lower count? Inquiring novices wanna know. That object looks so lovely. I'd buy it.

Edit: I have to wonder if a computer could handle the object these days. I use some pretty high count objects myself.



I used texture as a cheat to make a powwow shawl once: the optitex one. You can still find the texture over at sharecg. So yeah it could be done, but the fringe wouldn't fall correctly.
Fringe for shawls is also very long in some cases. I mean. Very long. Mine is 2 feet. and it was modest at the time.

EDIT: Another thing is if you look, fringe isn't as popular on traditional clothing as all that. That powwow dress of my dreams is a simple medieval tunic style dress with beadwork. Oh, the beadwork. The idea won't leave me alone. I think I'm going to end up trying to texture one before the year is out.

Because I tried it lower and higher and neither resulted in fringe I considered commercial quality. In fact, that's why I never released that one. Reducing the fringe count didn't give me enough fringe that I considered it commercial quality, and that was the maximum effect I thought was reasonable for customers.

While some may have high end computers, a lot of our users use laptops that are anything but.

Modeling is always a balancing act to "reasonable" for the largest amount of users.

Sure, I could model it so that fringe could be "painted on" in textures, and then watch as someone commented publicly about "lazy modelers" who can't be bothered to model the fringe. No thanks.

 

[Glitterati3D]

I've always wondered why there weren't more tasseled dynamic clothing (which always look so ugly on conforming clothes), but that would explain it.

Yeah, that's why. There's just no way to do reasonable poly counts and have it look like true fringe should. Too bad, though, because fringe really does rig well in weight map clothing as evidenced by the fringe on the sleeves of the Dusk PNWNA set. I was actually was surprised how easy it was to control with weight mapping for movement.

 

[Zaarin]

Yeah, that's why. There's just no way to do reasonable poly counts and have it look like true fringe should. Too bad, though, because fringe really does rig well in weight map clothing as evidenced by the fringe on the sleeves of the Dusk PNWNA set. I was actually was surprised how easy it was to control with weight mapping for movement.

Have you ever taken a look at what Frequency did with the fringe on her Patchwork Poncho? I don't own it, but the fringe looks pretty nice on it.

 

[Glitterati3D]

Have you ever taken a look at what Frequency did with the fringe on her Patchwork Poncho? I don't own it, but the fringe looks pretty nice on it.

Not until now, but that does look nice.