Songbird Remix's Product Preview Thread

[Klaus Sauer]

3DL is a great solution to render faster (Testrenders). Not every picture needs really Iray Shaders at all. Sometimes the colours of a 3DL are better than the ones with Iray (depending on light source). I still think 3DL is important and not a relic of the old days.

Furthermore, no one here knows for sure whether more Poser or DS users bought Ken's products. After all, there are hardly any (actually none) comparable products in DAZ in the field of birds, insects or amphibians.

But if you look at all the promo pictures of the various DAZ products, you'll be amazed at how often Songbird birds are on them. HiveWire has fortunately sold many products for both Poser and DAZ.

 

[Ken Gilliland]

Happy New Year!

I thought I'd give a brief update on where everything stands on my products.

First, I want to thank everyone for the support you've given me and Hivewire3D over the last 7 years. I can't thank-you enough for those who kept following me through my moves.

Renderosity will, next week start transferring products and data from the Hivewire store to theirs. I think the majority of HW vendors will be part of this process. I doubt you'll see everything reappearing at Renderosity on January 5th but vendors who already are selling at Renderosity like CWRW and HW (Chris's models) should reappear quickly. As for me, I've placed my two new sets, Songbird ReMix Characters v2 and Characters v3 already in their QA and they should appear in my brand new Renderosity store on the 5th (or close to it). The "Characters" series from the SBRM line features popular birds from North America and will have some favorites like chickadees, towhees, thrashers, kinglets and, of course, the tufted titmouse.

As for my promised updates, they were delayed and will appear at Renderosity when my products are transferred. My fingers are crossed that purchase data will also be processed so that you'll be able to seamlessly update your products. If not, I'll work with you, to make sure you do get your purchases recorded at Renderosity. These updates include on the SBRM end...

• Corvus corvus
• Threatened, Endangered, Extinct v2
• Cool and Unusual Birds v3

In addition, I have reworked most of the Nature's Wonders series to a character-based format and SBRM-like in its folder structure. The biggest changes there are to the Poser side which moves all the library files (Poses, Materials, Cameras, Props) into the Figures library.
These updates include "fauna" I've done. The NW environment "flora" sets will be next on my NW list to update.

What I currently working on? I'm almost finished with Cool and Unusual v1, about halfway through Africa and Second Edition, and starting Woodpeckers, European Edition v2 and Australia v2. Why this scattershot approach? Two reasons; I'm working with birds that I have updated model bases for, and second, it keeps things interesting for me (so it seems less like "work").

What's new on the horizon? Apart from plowing through more updates, I'm leaning towards wanting to do a set of Asian birds, after seeing these two stunning birds [1] [2] and I want to add to the NW dragonfly and turtle lines.

 

[Miss B]

What's new on the horizon? Apart from plowing through more updates, I'm leaning towards wanting to do a set of Asian birds, after seeing these two stunning birds [1] [2] and I want to add to the NW dragonfly and turtle lines.

Ohhh, I'm really liking the look of both of those Ken, especially the Yellow-cheeked Tit.

 

[manekiNeko]

Does anybody use 3Delight anymore with DAZ Studio? I was recently asked by testers why I still am including it since Iray is by far the renderer of choice in DS.

not very often, usually i use iray. however, i might still use 3dl if i use products that are older and in majority made for 3dl, and the transforming to iray doesn't work well.. 3dl is also "better" imo if you want a "fairytale"/storybook style, because iray can be too realistic for illustration (ofc, gimp etc, but with 3dl there's less work). and since you create animals, i think illustration might be appreciated in some cases, in others hyper-realism..

i'm still planning to install howie's AWE shading kit, which makes 3dl ever more realistic in some ways, so i might use 3dl more often again

 

[Doc Acme]

Ken,
In lieu of the forum, is the best place to contact you at SongbirdReMix.com ?

I've some technical questions, but have been making progress with FBX exporting out of DS for use in Lightwave.
Thanks.

 

[Ken Gilliland]

I'll still be maintaining a presence here, as I really like the HW forum set-up.
So there's this forum and HW PMs; at Renderosity-- there's my sitemail; my website this page, and of course, there's also Songbird ReMix Facebook

 

[Miss B]

That's good to know Ken, as we'll all want to know what you're working on, and even though I'm on the Renderosity forums, I spend most of my time here, as others do.

 

[Kerya]

I do prefer here instead of the Rero forums. I venture in there sometimes, but the atmosphere here is definitely nicer.

As for those Asian birds: squeeeeeeeeeeeeee! So cute!

 

[Klaus Sauer]

What's new on the horizon? Apart from plowing through more updates, I'm leaning towards wanting to do a set of Asian birds, after seeing these two stunning birds [1] [2] and I want to add to the NW dragonfly and turtle lines.

This species looks awesome. Have read the Wikipedia and it's almost unbelievable how big the family of the tit-birds is. You could fill at least two to three SBRM releases with that alone. Although I could imagine a title like "Tits of the world" possibly causing irritation as well.

 

[Ken Gilliland]

This species looks awesome. Have read the Wikipedia and it's almost unbelievable how big the family of the tit-birds is. You could fill at least two to three SBRM releases with that alone. Although I could imagine a title like "Tits of the world" possibly causing irritation as well.

Funny, because the hidden juvenile in me initially thought of that title, but doubted I could ever, or even want to, get away with naming it that. lol

I think it's important to say right now that the old english word "tittr", which the bird name is derived from (and means "little or small"), was in use hundreds of years BEFORE the slang term appeared.

I do have to think of a safe yet clever "...of the World" title for the set that won't offend anyone. I've also looking at creating two volumes of Bee-eaters (that would finish-out all the Bee-eaters in the world). After completing the bee model that was my planned next set, but I felt I really needed to get a bunch of updates done first before I could start something new.

 

[Doc Acme]

Ah, so it sounds as if this forum will remain then.

 

[Doc Acme]

I'll just go ahead & ask here then. More eyes and all.

It's taking me awhile just to figure out what & how I wanted to ask, largely due to the lack of DS documentation so bare with me.

When a character has a rig, I usually export my Daz assets via FBX and import into Lightwave. The export process from DS introduces some quirks that I've mostly worked around. For example, It likes to rename items & adds nulls in other places, such as used in deeper heirarchy for buttons, etc.

Even so, I'm normally able to export & import poses & sequences quickly using the Base Figure Pose Only option out of the Daz Export w/o issue for virtually all DAZ characters & critters. But the Songbirds have elements in DS I'm not familiar with (I have to assume that the pink Invisible items are involved) & somehow interferring with the exporting of complete Poses & hoping there's an easy way around that. The Pink Diamonds import as part of the geometry from the FBX w/ just a surface assignment. For now I've moved them to a separate model layer & hidden.

Anyway with Flight1 preset for example, I get part of the pose but not all. The Head & Wings in this case didn't, yet the Legs & Tail did. I can eventually mimic the pose in LW as I'm exporting most morphs, but that does take a lot of manual work.

Hope this makes sense. What might you enlighten me with?

 

[Ken Gilliland]

I'll just go ahead & ask here then. More eyes and all.

It's taking me awhile just to figure out what & how I wanted to ask, largely due to the lack of DS documentation so bare with me.

When a character has a rig, I usually export my Daz assets via FBX and import into Lightwave. The export process from DS introduces some quirks that I've mostly worked around. For example, It likes to rename items & adds nulls in other places, such as used in deeper heirarchy for buttons, etc.

Even so, I'm normally able to export & import poses & sequences quickly using the Base Figure Pose Only option out of the Daz Export w/o issue for virtually all DAZ characters & critters. But the Songbirds have elements in DS I'm not familiar with (I have to assume that the pink Invisible items are involved) & somehow interferring with the exporting of complete Poses & hoping there's an easy way around that. The Pink Diamonds import as part of the geometry from the FBX w/ just a surface assignment. For now I've moved them to a separate model layer & hidden.

Anyway with Flight1 preset for example, I get part of the pose but not all. The Head & Wings in this case didn't, yet the Legs & Tail did. I can eventually mimic the pose in LW as I'm exporting most morphs, but that does take a lot of manual work.

Hope this makes sense. What might you enlighten me with?The pink

The pink items you see are controllers which allow additional bending to the lShoulder and rShoulder parts. In some circles, they are referred to as "Ghost" bones. Ghost boning is common in clothing models (especially long dresses) which allow bending not normally achievable in a single part. Admittedly the ghosting works better in Poser than DAZ Studio, but in both programs, those ghost bone controllers act as bend points.

While the birds are modeled in Modo, they are rigged in Poser and exported (which some editing) into DAZ Studio, I haven't really played with an exported rigged bird outside of the Poser/DS universe in quite a while. One suggestion with Lightwave (if you can't get ghost boning to work) would be to take the lshldr/rshldr parts and using the controllers as a approximate joint marker, divide those two shoulders into 4 parts (eg lshldr, lforearm, lhand, lfeather), then delete the (pink) controllers and re-rig the wings in lightwave. I also suggest subdividing the wingfeathers & tailfeathers materials

 

[Ken Gilliland]

Ah, so it sounds as if this forum will remain then.

Yes, only the Hivewire Store is going away.... the forums are staying.

 

[Doc Acme]

I sorta almost kinda understand that.

I did some quick testing & can massage & get what LW calls Skelegons created on the modeling side from the "Controller" points and assign the correct wt. maps. Those can get exported to Layout & added to the current rig. Might even be able to set up as a Spline controller.

But I don't see how that would resolve the pose importing problem, or would it? Would give me deformation control I don't currently have, correct? In Daz they acted as Bones, but none of that info makes it through the export.

Might there be a conversion/baking process for the Controllers on the Daz side so they get included in the export to begin with?

Alos, I did end up triangulating much of the feather quads as I was getting render errors. Sub-D didn't seem to want to deal with that for some reason. I might experiment more with that later.

 

[Ken Gilliland]

I sorta almost kinda understand that.
....
Might there be a conversion/baking process for the Controllers on the Daz side so they get included in the export to begin with?

Alos, I did end up triangulating much of the feather quads as I was getting render errors. Sub-D didn't seem to want to deal with that for some reason. I might experiment more with that later.

Many of my poses have a combination of xyz bends and morphs-- wing folds and some of the wing bending are created that way

There might be a process or a special way of exporting but I'm out of my depth there since I haven't tried exporting anything recently. I did help an animator export some of birds a decade ago to Maya, but it was sort of the same thing I'm doing here-- explaining how the rigging works.

 

[Doc Acme]

OK. Well, thanks anyway. Perhaps if I can find info on the Controllers themselves that might give me a clue.

 

[Ken Gilliland]

Well, each of the controllers is technically a body part (aka ghost bone) that preside over the entire wing. In Poser, the wing acts as one part and the controllers as basically deformers on that part. In DAZ Studio, its setup up is a little different. To get a good idea of what goes on I suggest looking at the controllers via the weight mapping tool.

Maybe this illustration will explain the SBRM wing structure better...

 

[sapat]

This is for Ken. Totally random. I caught the tail end of a story on tv about a teenage Indian boy between 16 and 20, who went birding all around the area outside of his city (major city in India, missed the name). taking photos and documenting the names of all the birds he found.
This one bird caught my attention. It's got the same size and body shape as a parakeet, but it's got a regular beak. It's either got a bright blue body and bright yellow head, or vice versa. The way the colors blending from one to the other was lovely. I don't remember if it had any red, but the bright blue and yellow I do remember. The name I think referenced like yellow something, or blue headed something, and maybe even footed something.
Could I be anymore vague? Sorry, only info I have is India, teenage birder and photographer, and a bird I can't remember.

 

[Ken Gilliland]

sapat- it's really hard to tell what that might be... there are tons of colorful birds in the region that fit that description...