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Welcome to the Community Forums at HiveWire 3D! Please note that the user name you choose for our forum will be displayed to the public. Our store was closed as January 4, 2021. You can find HiveWire 3D and Lisa's Botanicals products, as well as many of our Contributing Artists, at Renderosity. This thread lists where many are now selling their products. Renderosity is generously putting products which were purchased at HiveWire 3D and are now sold at their store into customer accounts by gifting them. This is not an overnight process so please be patient, if you have already emailed them about this. If you have NOT emailed them, please see the 2nd post in this thread for instructions on what you need to do
Official Announcement: DAZ terminates agreement to publish HiveWire 3D animals!
- Thread starter Chris
- Start date
daywalker03
Eager
DAZ probably felt the financial pinch as much as they accepted "feedback" on the androgynous Genesis figure. Their CAs were very slow to adopt Genesis even though it was extremely popular at other sites and still is to this day with many freebie content makers.
AllenArt
Eager
I'm going to play devil's advocate here, even tho some won't like it, so here goes:
People need to remember that a forum is a PRIVATE entity and that the owners/operators can impose any rules they like - it's NOT a democracy. They can be heavy handed with the "censorship" or light, like Hivewire. Either way is ok with me because I don't run/own/pay for any of the forums I post in. For people that know me, it's a matter of course that some of my posts at Daz and elsewhere are going to disappear. They always have and that's just the way it is
. I don't think much of it anymore. I've known how the forums there are for years now. Posts of mine have disappeared in nearly every forum I frequent. Also ok. Sometimes posts and/or threads need to be shut down for the greater good, much as I love a more open forum style with people that feel they can speak freely. I hate to see it happen, because it usually means things have devolved to the point of dead horse beating. I'm hoping that doesn't happen here.
People need to remember that a forum is a PRIVATE entity and that the owners/operators can impose any rules they like - it's NOT a democracy. They can be heavy handed with the "censorship" or light, like Hivewire. Either way is ok with me because I don't run/own/pay for any of the forums I post in. For people that know me, it's a matter of course that some of my posts at Daz and elsewhere are going to disappear. They always have and that's just the way it is
. I don't think much of it anymore. I've known how the forums there are for years now. Posts of mine have disappeared in nearly every forum I frequent. Also ok. Sometimes posts and/or threads need to be shut down for the greater good, much as I love a more open forum style with people that feel they can speak freely. I hate to see it happen, because it usually means things have devolved to the point of dead horse beating. I'm hoping that doesn't happen here.
Terre
Renowned
It's also great for making movie monsters. I've seen quite a few renders with one or more animal and/or monster figures mixed with results from hilarious to truly excellent.
AllenArt
Eager
I use Genesis v1 all the time. I used it just yesterday for a monster. I loves the monsters...lol.
Used Mike 6 yesterday too....I have a thing for M6
. I'll use any figure that fits with what I'm trying to do...a few weeks ago I dug out the Zygote fairy
daywalker03
Eager
I'm going to play devil's advocate here, even tho some won't like it, so here goes:
People need to remember that a forum is a PRIVATE entity and that the owners/operators can impose any rules they like - it's NOT a democracy. They can be heavy handed with the "censorship" or light, like Hivewire. Either way is ok with me because I don't run/own/pay for any of the forums I post in. For people that know me, it's a matter of course that some of my posts at Daz and elsewhere are going to disappear. They always have and that's just the way it is
Agreed on the numerous poor deceased equines on the other forum, including the one called "forum search".
Hornet3d
Wise
I'm going to play devil's advocate here, even tho some won't like it, so here goes:
People need to remember that a forum is a PRIVATE entity and that the owners/operators can impose any rules they like - it's NOT a democracy. They can be heavy handed with the "censorship" or light, like Hivewire. Either way is ok with me because I don't run/own/pay for any of the forums I post in. For people that know me, it's a matter of course that some of my posts at Daz and elsewhere are going to disappear. They always have and that's just the way it is
That's a fair point, a forum is a Private entity and can be used as the owners like, but if you are running a forum I think there is at least some responsibility to try and play fiar. If a post is removed it would seem fair to explain why. I was recently suspended from from a forum for unspecified posts in another site's forum, was accused of lying and it was claimed I had been warned in the past. I asked around a month ago for further clarification and the owners have not bothered to reply, leaving me with no idea why I was banned, no idea where I have meant to have lied (so I cannot correct an error if it happened) and, to my knowledge I have never been warned. Now none of that relates to either Daz or Hivewire but it does show how you can be left with a nasty taste in the your mouth. Some will see that as bashing, I see it as a statement of fact that annoyed me at the time, so bashing is a very subjective entity.
I don't happen to agree entirely with Razor42 but there are a few areas where I share his concern. I too was disappointed when certain PAs were dragged into the argument and had to defend themselves, somewhere in these 29 pages I said very much the same thing.
I did like the idea of more members joining Hivewire and still do but that does not mean I want those new members not to visit Daz, the world is big enough to cater for both. It is a point that I did not see as an issue but understand from Razor42's post that this could be seen differently by others.
My personal view is that in the last 29 pages that most have been fairly well behaved but if someone thinks differently they are right to raise the point particularly if they fear a trend starting to appear. Such a post should be considered with any response given a little more thought, not because anything being said should not be said but the way we say it might mean it is received very differently than we intended.
Debating issues is cool. Even when the discussion gets a bit passionate. Artists do tend to be rather passionate as has been mentioned at HiveWire any number of times. The discussion just needs to remain about the issues and not the people participating in the issue.
Honestly, if you are a DAZ PA and have issues with DAZ 3D, or you are a DAZ PA and have issues with another DAZ PA, there is a better place than HiveWire to discuss that. Yeah?
Honestly, if you are a DAZ PA and have issues with DAZ 3D, or you are a DAZ PA and have issues with another DAZ PA, there is a better place than HiveWire to discuss that. Yeah?
Glitterati3D
Dances with Bees
Good points, Satira!
Hornet3d
Wise
I agree with all of that and while I felt some submissions could have been better worded (I am a fine one to talk) I do understand the passion behind some of this. Me, I am firmly on the fence, I do shop at Daz but that is limited as I am a Poser user, I hate no one, I have in the past but that one individual is now in a much better place. If am being truthful though, the events, rightly or wrongly, have made me change my priorities to spend more here at Hivewire for the coming months. I have no doubt I will go back to spending at Daz because they have some great quality sci-fi scenes that will work in Poser.
At the end of the Day, while some may think I have bashed Daz3D in the past I honestly want them the prosper, just not at the expense of others. I miss RDNA but accept that was a business decision and I blame no one for it, I just happen to feel the more marketplaces the better it is for me to buy quality content.
Personally, I have issues with forums where the rules are enforced inconsistently. Must be that Libra influence. I don't know how many times I've whined ... but, it's not FAIR! Yeah, yeah, yeah. Life isn't fair. But life's roll of the dice isn't a valid excuse for people to act like bullies. Nor is it justification to deprive some people of rights because they don't look like you, speak your language, worship your god, love the same gender you do, or come from the same countries your ancestors did. Granted ... forum inequality is rather insignificant. Sorta. It's just on a tiny scale what's wrong with society on the larger scale. /grumble.
Anyway ... I can live with a forum where the rules are clear and enforced consistently. Even if they are draconian But not when the rules are enforced only for some members ... simply because they don't hold the popular view, while those members who hold the popular view are allowed to attack members with no repercussions. I can't think of any other forum (including game forums where people get even more upset) where I've had posts pulled to the degree I had at DAZ. Usually, I could understand the explanation. But by 2013, my posts were being pulled with no explanation. I could only assume it was because I responded positively to comments about Dawn (or later, posted images of Dawn) ... while other posts mentioning Dawn (or HiveWire) negatively were allowed to remain.
I never had a problem with the original Genesis androgyny. I thought that was rather cool even. Nope. What upset me ... as well as other Poser users ... was that DAZ was no longer releasing figures that could be used natively in Poser. DAZ's solution (DSON) was haphazard at best, and non functional for me, as well as others. Why would it be a surprise that as PAs released less and less new content that could be used in Poser (rather quickly no less) even though that content was not clothing or characters, Poser users were upset? The androgyny thing was really an issue with DS users rather than Poser users. We had bigger concerns. Like ... a PC subscription that was increasingly rather worthless. Big problem when there were two years left on the subscription, and you couldn't get a refund. Nor could you take advantage of any of the "benefits" of being a PC member unless you wanted ancient content. Any wonder some of us felt really, really burned?
Oddly enough, it took a tiny little company with a handful of employees to develop a figure (in DS no less) that was fully able to take advantage of the same features in DS that Genesis does ... AND ... miracle of miracles since we'd been told so many times it was impossible ... worked fantastically in Poser ... natively.
Couldn't be done. Well no. Not until HiveWire came along with a goal of doing things right for both DS and Poser users.
Anyway ... I can live with a forum where the rules are clear and enforced consistently. Even if they are draconian
But not when the rules are enforced only for some members ... simply because they don't hold the popular view, while those members who hold the popular view are allowed to attack members with no repercussions. I can't think of any other forum (including game forums where people get even more upset) where I've had posts pulled to the degree I had at DAZ. Usually, I could understand the explanation. But by 2013, my posts were being pulled with no explanation. I could only assume it was because I responded positively to comments about Dawn (or later, posted images of Dawn) ... while other posts mentioning Dawn (or HiveWire) negatively were allowed to remain.I never had a problem with the original Genesis androgyny. I thought that was rather cool even. Nope. What upset me ... as well as other Poser users ... was that DAZ was no longer releasing figures that could be used natively in Poser. DAZ's solution (DSON) was haphazard at best, and non functional for me, as well as others. Why would it be a surprise that as PAs released less and less new content that could be used in Poser (rather quickly no less) even though that content was not clothing or characters, Poser users were upset? The androgyny thing was really an issue with DS users rather than Poser users. We had bigger concerns. Like ... a PC subscription that was increasingly rather worthless. Big problem when there were two years left on the subscription, and you couldn't get a refund. Nor could you take advantage of any of the "benefits" of being a PC member unless you wanted ancient content. Any wonder some of us felt really, really burned?
Oddly enough, it took a tiny little company with a handful of employees to develop a figure (in DS no less) that was fully able to take advantage of the same features in DS that Genesis does ... AND ... miracle of miracles since we'd been told so many times it was impossible ... worked fantastically in Poser ... natively.
Couldn't be done. Well no. Not until HiveWire came along with a goal of doing things right for both DS and Poser users.
I apologise if that is what you inferred from my post it was not my intent at all, quite the opposite, everyone should be able to voice their opinion if it's done with respect to others, people should feel able to put forward an opposing viewpoint without being attacked and ganged up on, personally I don't feel comfortable voicing how I feel here and often keep quiet because I know what the result will be if I do say anything.
Hornet3d
Wise
Oh and personally? I was one of those people who didn't like the decision to sell HiveWire animals exclusively at DAZ. I don't see it as hypocritical in the least that those of us who didn't like the partnership also are upset over the decision by DAZ to drop the HiveWire animals.
We might not have agreed with HiveWire's decision, but at the end of the day ... what was important was that we supported HiveWire.
You see ... HiveWire is open and honest with their customers. That's a really cool thing and one of many things about HiveWire, Chris, Lisa, Paul, and Alisa I greatly admire. To have that partnership ended so abruptly by DAZ was rather uncool. Especially since the partnership was discontinued not because the quality of the HiveWire animals wasn't up to DAZ's expectations, but because HiveWire continued to be open and honest with us and not only addressed our concerns, but admitted to sharing some concerns.
Were we supposed to celebrate? That's now how we work here.
We might not have agreed with HiveWire's decision, but at the end of the day ... what was important was that we supported HiveWire.
You see ... HiveWire is open and honest with their customers. That's a really cool thing and one of many things about HiveWire, Chris, Lisa, Paul, and Alisa I greatly admire. To have that partnership ended so abruptly by DAZ was rather uncool. Especially since the partnership was discontinued not because the quality of the HiveWire animals wasn't up to DAZ's expectations, but because HiveWire continued to be open and honest with us and not only addressed our concerns, but admitted to sharing some concerns.
Were we supposed to celebrate? That's now how we work here.
PoisenedLily
Inspired
I am sorry, what would YOU call someone that knowingly violates an NDA just because they feel wronged while hiding behind a fake name? What would YOU call a person who is publicly bashing sites and people behind a fake name? Instead of being a grown up and handling it with some maturity?
They have stated they sell at other sites, so leave Daz and sell there. Don't cry about it and leak info and bash your fellow vendors over it.
PoisenedLily
Inspired
I hadn't seen where it said THAT was why it was dissolved. But then again its a very long post lol Would you be able to point this out? Reading 30 pages or so I tend to miss stuff hehe Thank you!
eclark1894
Visionary
I'd call them by their name or the name they're known as here in the forum. Look, if a contract was breached between DAZ and another party, unless you were also a party to that contract, let DAZ handle it. What are you getting so worked up over?
Fair enough. Now why don't we all practice what we preach, act like the adults we all claim to be, and stop calling people names?
If you don't think you can do this, then perhaps it's time to take a step back and step away from the keyboard.
I wouldn't call them anything on the forums. I'd click Report. Which is what you should do if you feel someone is bashing another brokerage or another person or sharing confidential information.
Or ... as a Community Volunteer, I'd remove their post. Which is exactly what I did. Last night. Within 30 minutes of the confidential information being posted. Kind of a done deal now, isn't it?
Or ... as a Community Volunteer, I'd remove their post. Which is exactly what I did. Last night. Within 30 minutes of the confidential information being posted. Kind of a done deal now, isn't it?