Dawn 2.0 Underway

[eclark1894]

I meant an A-pose rig, actually, like Ang2, Scarlet, oritginal Bella and, why not mention her also, Genesis8. have.
I saw the images for a moment I thought there would be an alternative Dawn2 with A-pose rig. I understand now that is not the case.

There are many good reasons for developing clothing that features sleeves in 'A' pose. That is how most garments are cut in real life. If they would be cut them in 'T' pose you would end up with a large ball of fabric under the arm pits in the lower arm positions that are most frequent. In real life that is uncomfortable unless the fabric is very stretchy. In dynamic clothing that ball of facets is a sure receipe for trouble and slow performance. Conformers in T pose have huge distortion on the shoulders.

An old Sway I made, based on Bella in the Beta days of A-pose, explains some aspects.
There also is a pdf for those who prefer that format, but it looks less good.

With all due respect, I don't believe any of that is true. In real life you have a lot of differing factors, like dynamics and gravity are ALWAYS on. You can't turn them off to see how the cloth falls. Also, most clothing is made based on patterns. It's made, cut and pinned, and most people couldn't stand with outstretched arms in a T-pose for long enough to make any clothing.

 

[MEC4D]

Not really true? how are you doing to make a suit in T pose ? we don't want to make neoprene clothing anymore , some clothing are not made for T pose anyway, not in digital or real world. I don't understand why the arguments about, everyone doing what works best for them.

Now a real image for those that don't make clothing , I hope you will understand the case of T pose here when the clothing are made for A pose , especially if your process of making clothing is dynamic based like MD or Zbrush , some clothing simply are not made for T pose

 

[RobZhena]

The A pose is terrible for converting clothing. And let’s face it: we’ll all be converting clothing for a long time. Bella was a good example of the problem until Ali went to T pose. I personally would not use Dawn 2.0 with an A pose zero setting.

 

[Pendraia]

With all due respect, I don't believe any of that is true. In real life you have a lot of differing factors, like dynamics and gravity are ALWAYS on. You can't turn them off to see how the cloth falls. Also, most clothing is made based on patterns. It's made, cut and pinned, and most people couldn't stand with outstretched arms in a T-pose for long enough to make any clothing.

Most seamstresses would have before flat patterns draped the pattern on either a real person or a dressmakers dummy. Flatpattern making allows dressmakers to produce a sleeve patter so isn't necessary to have anyone stand with arms out for either of these processes. In fact they would most likely be in an A pose for most things.

 

[Pendraia]

The A pose is terrible for converting clothing. And let’s face it: we’ll all be converting clothing for a long time. Bella was a good example of the problem until Ali went to T pose. I personally would not use Dawn 2.0 with an A pose zero setting.

But if they provided both options you could chose which one you used. As someone who converts a lot of clothing from genesis to Dawn I can see this being really useful for me.

 

[MEC4D]

The A pose is terrible for converting clothing. And let’s face it: we’ll all be converting clothing for a long time. Bella was a good example of the problem until Ali went to T pose. I personally would not use Dawn 2.0 with an A pose zero setting.

Let me explain, the standard rigging of Dawn 2 need to be as usual in T pose for everyone to use , the second rigging for creators with A pose is just for clothing creations and nothing else ( internal usage) , it will comfort just fine for the standard rig with T pose . And that is all about . Everyone will have the proper option for own workflow not affecting another . Not big deal
However it will attract other creators and that's what it is about.

 

[CG Cubed]

Here is a much needed update on the rigging progress. WIP on the face rig! And yes it works in Poser too!

 

[CG Cubed]

Oh and as Mec4D has mentioned, the "A" pose is for clothing creators who want to use it. It is not the zero pose. The zero pose is the "T" pose.

You can still use the "A" Pose to transfer clothing too.

 

[MEC4D]

Oh and as Mec4D has mentioned, the "A" pose is for clothing creators who want to use it. It is not the zero pose. The zero pose is the "T" pose.

You can still use the "A" Pose to transfer clothing too.

I think people that got confused were users of Poser. DS users are mostly familiar with this process and functionality. Genesis have additional zero pose A rig for PA's only that make clothing. But a simple A pose will works as well or any pose for this matter. I just asked early as no access for the beta rig yet and want to work on it already.
Thanks Paul for the updates

 

[MEC4D]

Here is a much needed update on the rigging progress. WIP on the face rig! And yes it works in Poser too!

That is great, I was worry I will have to do all the extra work for all the unique facial morphs from zero. I hope my new (never done before) dynamic skin morphs will works with this .

 

[Pendraia]

@CG Cubed great work on the facial rig so far. I was wondering if this is the new system for rigging in DS rather than Triax?

 

[RAMWolff]

Thanks so much for the update Paul!

 

[CG Cubed]

Actually this is triax. The general weight maps are an industry standard but has limitations. The twist weights have to be done on an extra bone because each bone only uses 1 weight map. Also the weights use a different interpolation so they look more like a hose or elbow macaroni, which requires more blend shapes/morphs to correct the joints. It does have some pros too. You can map the translations with the same weight map and It is good for converting to other programs, since most use it.

What DAZ calls triax is what Poser uses, multiple weight maps per bone. This allows for fewer bones and better interpolation. It also gives us the ability to use bulge maps. Overall better bends and less corrective morphs and bones. And this is better supported in both programs.

 

[Chris]

Video looks great Paul. Always fun to see what you're working on. This will be a welcome addition for our users for sure.

Thanks for sharing.

 

[Pendraia]

Actually this is triax. The general weight maps are an industry standard but has limitations. The twist weights have to be done on an extra bone because each bone only uses 1 weight map. Also the weights use a different interpolation so they look more like a hose or elbow macaroni, which requires more blend shapes/morphs to correct the joints. It does have some pros too. You can map the translations with the same weight map and It is good for converting to other programs, since most use it.

What DAZ calls triax is what Poser uses, multiple weight maps per bone. This allows for fewer bones and better interpolation. It also gives us the ability to use bulge maps. Overall better bends and less corrective morphs and bones. And this is better supported in both programs.

Thanks for the response Paul...I actually know Triax better than the general weights so in some ways its easier.

 

[jartz]

D2 is looking good so far. Looking forward to her.

 

[Ken1171]

Looking good, Paul! Thanks for sharing the progress! ヾ(^▽^*)))

 

[FVerbaas]

Not really true? how are you doing to make a suit in T pose ? we don't want to make neoprene clothing anymore...

Now a real image for those that don't make clothing...

Indeed. That image shows what it is all about. Becomes even more interesting if the fabric has a distinct print or woven pattern, not to mention the jacket button be undone.

 

[MEC4D]

@Chris , I know you have a lot on the plate, just a reminder ( if you did not do it already) to make a corneal bulge morph for the eyeballs , very important , without it the eyes will be flat and soulless since the corneal bulge reflecting the environment at 180 degree and minimizing the reflection scale compared to the rest of the eyeball. It simply makes the eyes look alive with that extra sparkle . Even when using just indoor lighting, it will scale down the specular reflection for the proper look. Also there would be correct distance between the cornea and iris when using IOR material for a beautiful effect. On top people will skip the need to make fake corneal reflections using textures.

Cath

 

[Faery_Light]

I hope I can afford her and Dusk 2 when they finally come out in the store.