I'll put the new DAZ setup on the server soon. I think I am basically done. Will add the three new textures which will be part of an addon package as well. Gimme a week.. I start working next week again and time will be harder to come by to get ready.
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seahorse for Harry
- Thread starter FreyrStrongart
- Start date
I'll put the new DAZ setup on the server soon. I think I am basically done. Will add the three new textures which will be part of an addon package as well. Gimme a week.. I start working next week again and time will be harder to come by to get ready.
StudioMartillo
Engaged
No. It can't be already assembled. Harry has to be in the scene already, or else has to be loaded from the HiveWire 3D library.
The magical prop could put any combination of figures together. Or figures and props, and parent things to various body parts of Harry.
The test version you tried is doing that. But with only the one item.
I forget now if script can tell the conforming items to conform though.
Better review that one.
So what I was saying is that if you did various assemblies on your workstation, in Poser, and run the creator script, it would produce a magical prop that keeps all the data needed to re-assemble that combination of items for the customer.
On the customer's computer.
Of course the customer would need to have all the parts in their library, but the magic prop wouldn't be any good without the parts so it would all be together in a sort of 'kit'.
Something like that. Whatever combinations you had envisioned.
Hmmm. so how could that work... as far as product combinations.
Well, you have to decide that.
Whatever parts you decide to have pre-assembled won't matter.
The tool will just look at what's there and save the state into custom data in the magical prop.
No geometry will be in the prop.
The magical prop could put any combination of figures together. Or figures and props, and parent things to various body parts of Harry.
The test version you tried is doing that. But with only the one item.
I forget now if script can tell the conforming items to conform though.
Better review that one.
So what I was saying is that if you did various assemblies on your workstation, in Poser, and run the creator script, it would produce a magical prop that keeps all the data needed to re-assemble that combination of items for the customer.
On the customer's computer.
Of course the customer would need to have all the parts in their library, but the magic prop wouldn't be any good without the parts so it would all be together in a sort of 'kit'.
Something like that. Whatever combinations you had envisioned.
Hmmm. so how could that work... as far as product combinations.
Well, you have to decide that.
Whatever parts you decide to have pre-assembled won't matter.
The tool will just look at what's there and save the state into custom data in the magical prop.
No geometry will be in the prop.
Wow! That would be a fantastic thing! I guess I would need four base figures, or possibly six. For every frontleg variation two tail variations. The manes don't need any fancy stuff they work without problems as conforming props. The gills as well.
The script actually creates like a complicated single figure which has, for example two pelvis bones. This means that the horse pelvis doesn't influence the fishpelvis, which could mean that under certain conditions the mesh might break apart. I will need to test it with the modified facegroup.
StudioMartillo
Engaged
That sounds right. Didn't know how the Seahorse parts were rigged. But if the tail's hip is parented to Harry's hip and you can't see Harry's pelvis at all it might be OK as is.
Well now...
I think I see why you got that question about which figure coincided with the filename.
Looking at the screen-shots you posted I see there is a problem with directory structure.
Really can't figure out exactly how you have these things but it's not the conventional structure.
So it's going to be real hard to get the tool to cooperate with Poser.
And it could be that HiveWire wouldn't want to publish it the way it is.
There's a standard 'Runtime' structure that Poser expects.
And when things aren't arranged this way it get's kinda stubborn.
So here is what it would expect to see for your Seahorse product:
Poser
Documentation
FreyrStrongArt
FS_Seahorse
(the read me's etc. here)
Runtime
Geometries
FreyrStrongArt
FS_Seahorse
(the obj files here)
Libraries
Character
FreyrStrongArt
FS_Seahorse
(the cr2 files here)
Materials
FreyrStrongArt
FS_Seahorse
(the .mc6 files here)
Props
FreyrStrongArt
FS_Seahorse
(the pp2 files here)
Python
poserScripts
FreyrStrongArt
FS_Seahorse
(the .py scripts here)
textures
FreyrStrongArt
FS_Seahorse
(the .jpg files here)
And to zip the file for distribution you would zip the whole runtime.
What I do is make a directory called PoserPkg, and then copy all of the directory parts of the product into that directory.
So it would look much like what is above for the Seahorse except the 'Poser' directory would be 'PoserPkg' and it would have nothing else in it.
That is, only the bare minimum of directories to hold whatever files are required for the product, and the files in them.
Then zip the 'Runtime' directory of PoserPkg and name the zip file the same as the product name.
Just trying to be helpful here, but with the current configuration I don't think I could get the tool to work.
And the magical prop wouldn't be a one click you're done solution because Poser would give the customer a hard time.
Also, when I'm making a new product I use a directory named 'PoserDev'.
And because that directory has a link to it in the Poser Library all of the standard library sub-directories are there because the Poser Library App just puts them all there when it indexes it.
So in there I have all of the product development files on all of the products I've made.
And when a product is done I put the stuff in PoserPkg, zip it, and then unzip it to my main 'Poser' directory for the final test.
Well now...
I think I see why you got that question about which figure coincided with the filename.
Looking at the screen-shots you posted I see there is a problem with directory structure.
Really can't figure out exactly how you have these things but it's not the conventional structure.
So it's going to be real hard to get the tool to cooperate with Poser.
And it could be that HiveWire wouldn't want to publish it the way it is.
There's a standard 'Runtime' structure that Poser expects.
And when things aren't arranged this way it get's kinda stubborn.
So here is what it would expect to see for your Seahorse product:
Poser
Documentation
FreyrStrongArt
FS_Seahorse
(the read me's etc. here)
Runtime
Geometries
FreyrStrongArt
FS_Seahorse
(the obj files here)
Libraries
Character
FreyrStrongArt
FS_Seahorse
(the cr2 files here)
Materials
FreyrStrongArt
FS_Seahorse
(the .mc6 files here)
Props
FreyrStrongArt
FS_Seahorse
(the pp2 files here)
Python
poserScripts
FreyrStrongArt
FS_Seahorse
(the .py scripts here)
textures
FreyrStrongArt
FS_Seahorse
(the .jpg files here)
And to zip the file for distribution you would zip the whole runtime.
What I do is make a directory called PoserPkg, and then copy all of the directory parts of the product into that directory.
So it would look much like what is above for the Seahorse except the 'Poser' directory would be 'PoserPkg' and it would have nothing else in it.
That is, only the bare minimum of directories to hold whatever files are required for the product, and the files in them.
Then zip the 'Runtime' directory of PoserPkg and name the zip file the same as the product name.
Just trying to be helpful here, but with the current configuration I don't think I could get the tool to work.
And the magical prop wouldn't be a one click you're done solution because Poser would give the customer a hard time.
Also, when I'm making a new product I use a directory named 'PoserDev'.
And because that directory has a link to it in the Poser Library all of the standard library sub-directories are there because the Poser Library App just puts them all there when it indexes it.
So in there I have all of the product development files on all of the products I've made.
And when a product is done I put the stuff in PoserPkg, zip it, and then unzip it to my main 'Poser' directory for the final test.
StudioMartillo
Engaged
I think you probably have this figured out, but...
Do the group creation thing with the test figures, and then go ahead and assign the 'hidden' groups to the "Hidden" material and set the diffuse, specular, and transparency as described above.
The you will see what I'm proposing that the magical prop will do, and we'll know how that's gonna work.
StudioMartillo
Engaged
Arg, that directory structure is messed up.
I'll try a screen shot:
I'll try a screen shot:
Oh thanks for this. I just tried to copy the file structure for the HiveWireHorse as I expected the files to go there to find the stuff easier. This would put the seahorse outside the Harry product structure. Well... You have the experience, I will follow your setup. I am a newb and any hints to make things easier to handle are welcome. I have been thinking that it would probably not be a click and go solution, as I couldn't see a way to save the facegroups. This will be a somewhat difficult product for the user ... I am thinking of offering it as a Freebie as I can't see a satisfactory way to make it work easily in Poser. I couldn't sell it with a good conscience and I don't think it could get past the Q&A the way it is now.
after all that fiddling around I found that the group editor for the tail end actually offered the simplest solution, although it is up to the user to do it. By assigning the last hip row to the abdomen it is possible to make the hip disappear completely AND the mesh doesn't tear so you get a very smooth transition. But since that is not a customer friendly solution I guess I will still offer the set as a freebie.
Cliff Bowman
Adventurous
IMO StudioMartillo is doing his best to help make it possible to automate what would otherwise be a very tricky end user workflow. In your position I personally would be tempted to offer him the file to work with directly, to cut down (not eliminate) the to-and-fro, but even without that I see great potential for StudioMartillo's code and/or ideas to result in a nice easy workflow for the end user. It's taking time and effort to get there, but if you can do it once in the Group Editor then it can be automated for a second user, and a third, and so on.
Cheers,
Cliff
it would need something that would allow to assign to harry the new distribution of facegroups. It doesn't actually need the merging of the tail and horse figures as that means the abdomen doesn't influence the hip - pelvis group of the tail and that means the mesh can split. Now that I have analysed the problem what I would need is a helper to apply the required change of facegroups and automatically make invisible the not required ones. No actual merging between the two figures is required. I could then set in the utilities the required changes so that would give the user a one click application for every figure they load. It would need only three different apps in my case and once the things stands it would open the door for any number of other conforming add-ons for poser figures. I just need to be able to record and apply the new distribution of the facegroups and the hidden bones and voilà. Question is just... would it be just a just? I don't know how it would be possible to record and assign a change of the faces and which bones are visible.. ok the bones is prolly solved. From StudioMartillo's script I can see how I can adapt the script do turn the visibility of any required bone off. But assigning the new distribution of faces? I might not have understood everything SM described but I know understand what I would need.
StudioMartillo
Engaged
I tried that initially but was having difficulty with the dreadful group editor, but I'll try it again.
The way I described above, just changing some of the hip to an invisible material should have the same effect.
It is possible for script to log all that. And then reproduce it again.
I was explaining it above only without referring to the Poser Python methods that do it.
It takes a few methods to collect all that, and some data structures.
I've done a very similar thing already so there are chunks of code called 'functions' that I have made and stored away in my python library which can be reused for this.
So it's kind of like putting together modules.
Well, have faith. I'm pretty sure about this, so hang in there 'till I can make a test version.
I'm having fun with it anyway, and can go further without needing your geometry, but it might help.
I made some test geometry that is so stupid looking that I had to laugh. But, I apologized to Harry for laughing at him.
StudioMartillo
Engaged
Oh, another thing.
If you have Harry and some other parts in the scene, and have changed around groups with the group editor.
Just save the scene. It will all be saved. Including the polygon assignments you have made.
Then you could reload the scene to work on it again, or to run the Seahorse Factory kit that I'm building.
If you have Harry and some other parts in the scene, and have changed around groups with the group editor.
Just save the scene. It will all be saved. Including the polygon assignments you have made.
Then you could reload the scene to work on it again, or to run the Seahorse Factory kit that I'm building.
Oh... the penny just dropped. Has taken me long enough, I just didn't get the thing about the hidden material. This sounds very promising and fairly 'uncomplicated' compared to the previous ideas. Sorry to be so slow on the uptake. Going to work on the textures for the Poser then. You can pick up the geometry for the tail an stuff in the private conversation.
hu... help? What's superfly doing here?
I created a mat to hide the parts of the hip that are not used... it renders fine in firefly but superfly creates a hole where the hip material happens to overlap the fishtail. You can see that it is an actual hole at the bottom of the belly. Is that a problem of the rendersettings of the material? Anyone knows?
I created a mat to hide the parts of the hip that are not used... it renders fine in firefly but superfly creates a hole where the hip material happens to overlap the fishtail. You can see that it is an actual hole at the bottom of the belly. Is that a problem of the rendersettings of the material? Anyone knows?
Cliff Bowman
Adventurous
Looks like you don't have Superfly material setup correctly. Can you please show a screen capture of the Material Room with that material selected?
Cheers,
Cliff
Cheers,
Cliff
Cliff Bowman
Adventurous
Sorry for the delay in a detailed screen-capture reply - I've spent all morning responding to things thinking "I will put 'Wish You Were Here' on in a minute" but never taking the time to do so. I need some Floyd, so I have now set that album going.... now, you need a SuperFly material. This animation shows two basic choices - either just ticking "Use the same material details for SuperFly" or "Use this extra material info for SuperFly" (with the extra material data defined in a similar way for SuperFly but taking advantage of it's improvements over Firefly).
I SUSPECT you have neither - in which case Poser doesn't know what to render as the surface of those particular polygons. As usual, there are other possibilities, that one just strikes me as most likely?
Cheers,
Cliff
nope... That can't be the problem, both checkboxes are checked in the PoserSurface. Something else must be the matter. Can it have something to do with the render settings of superfly?
Cliff Bowman
Adventurous
Anything is possible, but I can't think what in SuperFly settings would do that (it'd be easier to cause something like that in Firefly, to be honest).
Hrm. nope, my mind's a blank. Assuming you can see that strip in Preview, and that re-rendering in it firefly works (go on, just to test) I'm currently flummoxed.
I mean - it LOOKs rather like backface culling, but if it was backface culling then it shouldn't render correctly in FireFly either Would a similar structure be required for the DAZ section? I set it up to be put inside the hivewire horse as all other products were designed the same way. Or is this different because it is a figure?
StudioMartillo
Engaged
There seems to be a kind of convention for the top directories in each library section.
Which is that it is the name of the artist, or company which publishes the items contained in it.
So it's like a domain in a way.
How you structure your runtime for a product is going to affect the runtimes of everyone who downloads and installs your product.
And if it is placing items in the HiveWire directories then it's making a change to HiveWire's domain.
If you submit your product with that structure it will likely be rejected because of it.
I wouldn't want some other artist or studio putting their products in my domain.
That would seem to me like it was being messed up.
Once you have bought lots of Poser products, and look at your library you would see this.
Some really old stuff has crazy structures. Like products placed at the top level.
And product names starting with the '!' character so they will be listed first.
But Poserites with a little experience easily find their content because they are used to the convention.
So they would naturally look for your stuff in FreyrStrongart.
When I buy DAZ stuff, it just has one extra level for the library at the top called 'Content' I think.
And then below that it's pretty much the same as the Poser runtime.
But then I mostly buy older stuff, or make my own, which is what I enjoy most.
Which is that it is the name of the artist, or company which publishes the items contained in it.
So it's like a domain in a way.
How you structure your runtime for a product is going to affect the runtimes of everyone who downloads and installs your product.
And if it is placing items in the HiveWire directories then it's making a change to HiveWire's domain.
If you submit your product with that structure it will likely be rejected because of it.
I wouldn't want some other artist or studio putting their products in my domain.
That would seem to me like it was being messed up.
Once you have bought lots of Poser products, and look at your library you would see this.
Some really old stuff has crazy structures. Like products placed at the top level.
And product names starting with the '!' character so they will be listed first.
But Poserites with a little experience easily find their content because they are used to the convention.
So they would naturally look for your stuff in FreyrStrongart.
When I buy DAZ stuff, it just has one extra level for the library at the top called 'Content' I think.
And then below that it's pretty much the same as the Poser runtime.
But then I mostly buy older stuff, or make my own, which is what I enjoy most.