Poser on borrowed time?

[Dylan]

I stumbled across this financial report from Smith micro, owners of Poser:

Smith Micro Reports 2017 First Quarter Financial Results

It made me wonder how secure is Posers future, taking into account also the incompatibility of newer DAZ Genesis figures in Poser. Food for thought I suppose.

 

[Carey]

I keep thinking each new version will be the last... But as a dedicated poser user since version 3 I will continue to keep plugging away with it...lol

 

[Willowisp]

Well, according to the SM forum, the new Poser team is working on SR7 for P11, so they are still committed to Poser. Whether SM as a company will survive, who knows. If they fold, someone might buy Poser from them, wouldn't be the first time in posers history!

 

[Satira Capriccio]

I've always wondered whether we are but a small part of the overall picture, or whether we are the bulk of the users. How many users of Poser simply use the Poser content or make their own rather than purchasing content from providers like DAZ, HiveWire, etc. If we are the bulk of those who purchase Poser, I can see how the DAZ Genesis incompatibility with Poser would negatively affect the sales of Poser.

Look at the animation action series RWBY (Rooster Teeth). Characters, props, and sets are created in Maya, but the animation is done with Poser.

How many other companies or artists use Poser professionally, but don't rely on purchased content? For that matter, I don't think it's very appealing to professionals to have to replace their content every time a new figure comes out. I think too the type of figures, characters, and clothing most popular to the hobbyist market, isn't all that appealing to the professional market. Not that I consider all users of Poser or DAZ Studio to be hobbyists ... and am rather annoyed when I'm classified as a hobbyist. But ... hobbyists probably do make up the bulk of customers purchasing content from DAZ, HiveWire, etc.

Anyway ... I too suspect Poser will be sold yet again rather than disappear into an abyss. I wasn't all that happy when Poser was purchased by Smith Micro, but it's not been all that bad for Poser ... or for us. Clearly, there is something about Poser that makes it valuable as an investment.

Even if the Poser figures aren't all that appealing to many of us :wink:

 

[3WC]

If DAZ buys it, it may just never be updated again. :\

 

[SndCastie]

I don't know about anyone else but all the Gen figures look the same I just wish all the venders would still suport Poser with V4 and M4 and God forbid Daz takes it over it would definately go the wayside

 

[Glitterati3D]

Well, according to the SM forum, the new Poser team is working on SR7 for P11, so they are still committed to Poser. Whether SM as a company will survive, who knows. If they fold, someone might buy Poser from them, wouldn't be the first time in posers history!

Thanks, Willow, for adding some sanity to this conversation.

I'm really tired of every Poser forum, every day there is some variation of folks cheerleading for SM's failure. ENOUGH.

We have no inside information and therefore this whole conversation is nothing more than wishful thinking pushing SM's stock value down even further.

 

[Glitterati3D]

I've always wondered whether we are but a small part of the overall picture, or whether we are the bulk of the users. How many users of Poser simply use the Poser content or make their own rather than purchasing content from providers like DAZ, HiveWire, etc. If we are the bulk of those who purchase Poser, I can see how the DAZ Genesis incompatibility with Poser would negatively affect the sales of Poser.

Look at the animation action series RWBY (Rooster Teeth). Characters, props, and sets are created in Maya, but the animation is done with Poser.

How many other companies or artists use Poser professionally, but don't rely on purchased content? For that matter, I don't think it's very appealing to professionals to have to replace their content every time a new figure comes out. I think too the type of figures, characters, and clothing most popular to the hobbyist market, isn't all that appealing to the professional market. Not that I consider all users of Poser or DAZ Studio to be hobbyists ... and am rather annoyed when I'm classified as a hobbyist. But ... hobbyists probably do make up the bulk of customers purchasing content from DAZ, HiveWire, etc.

Anyway ... I too suspect Poser will be sold yet again rather than disappear into an abyss. I wasn't all that happy when Poser was purchased by Smith Micro, but it's not been all that bad for Poser ... or for us. Clearly, there is something about Poser that makes it valuable as an investment.

Even if the Poser figures aren't all that appealing to many of us :wink:

All excellent points, Satira!

 

[Dylan]

I don't think any of us want SM to fail, as that probably means no more Poser for those of us who like it and would love to see more vendors supporting it.

 

[Glitterati3D]

I don't think any of us want SM to fail, as that probably means no more Poser for those of us who like it and would love to see more vendors supporting it.

Sorry, Dylan, it just every forum where Poser users are welcome that I'm seeing this kind of behavior.

I didn't mean to take it out on you, just that I am frustrated.

I know things are tough at DAZ right now (the annual vendor culling is about to begin, and some staffers have been fired) so folks are in a negative place, but I have just had enough is all.

 

[Dylan]

Sorry, Dylan, it just every forum where Poser users are welcome that I'm seeing this kind of behavior.

I didn't mean to take it out on you, just that I am frustrated.

I know things are tough at DAZ right now (the annual vendor culling is about to begin, and some staffers have been fired) so folks are in a negative place, but I have just had enough is all.

That's cool. I wasn't aware that things were bad at DAZ as well. I always got the impression the DAZ store is a hugely profitable place.

 

[Glitterati3D]

That's cool. I wasn't aware that things were bad at DAZ as well. I always got the impression the DAZ store is a hugely profitable place.

Sales are way down and several staffers, including Syyd, were fired recently. And DAZ goes through the vendor list annually and culls those vendors who haven't sold enough. On top of that their attempt to bring Poser users back to them with the RDNA store purchase was largely unsuccessful, so corporate DAZ is not very happy.

Even BadKitteh (Connie) was complaining on Facebook recently about how bad sales are and voicing resentment toward vendors who are happy with "a couple hundred in sales" saying she can't live on that. She was talking about taking a full time job.

 

[VortigensBane]

Mainly commenting to get updated news, but...

I do have to admit that it has been about 4 months since I opened Poser myself, but in all honesty, I think that both DAZ and SM's problem is that there is a single niche that almost all of the content fits into (mostly naked women with odd bits of armor and weapons + background), and that the "improvements" that come out with each new generation of figures are not equally updated, and are mostly undesirable. For instance... Hair models for the newest generation of figures are made almost exactly the same way as hair models for Victoria 3. The only difference is that there are larger texture maps and maybe a few more morphs. Figures, however, get additional bones, weightmapping, muscle-flexing, etc., etc.... I would love to see an updated hair system which is strand based (LAMH), but is in some way dynamic. Poser hair is dynamic, but it is even more of a pain to work with than LAMH... I don't want a new generation of figures (G8), because the morphs and characters which I bought for G3 don't work. I never used the SM figures in Poser. EVER. I used M4/V4 until G3 came along. I bought so many add-on packs for both figures that to "upgrade" is not an economical option. I just want real-looking hair, and better dynamic clothing. There are so many characters released every week you can't possibly render them all, or even buy them all; I have loads that I liked the look of, but haven't been able to render yet. I have to admit though, that lots of the newly released stuff on almost all the sites doesn't appeal to me at all, with a few notable exceptions. I would even be willing to pay more for items that have more work put into them, rather than stuff that is so generic that it might share half its geometry with the vendors previous release... (but don't tell anyone that, because my wallet won't appreciate it!)

 

[eclark1894]

Sales are way down and several staffers, including Syyd, were fired recently. And DAZ goes through the vendor list annually and culls those vendors who haven't sold enough. On top of that their attempt to bring Poser users back to them with the RDNA store purchase was largely unsuccessful, so corporate DAZ is not very happy.

Even BadKitteh (Connie) was complaining on Facebook recently about how bad sales are and voicing resentment toward vendors who are happy with "a couple hundred in sales" saying she can't live on that. She was talking about taking a full time job.

Hmm, a couple hundred. I made that much selling my Roxie stuff at CP. If I hit the lottery, I'd buy Poser in a heartbeat, then sponsor Blender with the caveat that I can incorporate some of their stuff in Poser.

 

[Glitterati3D]

Hmm, a couple hundred. I made that much selling my Roxie stuff at CP. If I hit the lottery, I'd buy Poser in a heartbeat, then sponsor Blender with the caveat that I can incorporate some of their stuff in Poser.

Illuminating, isn't it?

 

[Willowisp]

Sales are way down and several staffers, including Syyd, were fired recently. And DAZ goes through the vendor list annually and culls those vendors who haven't sold enough. On top of that their attempt to bring Poser users back to them with the RDNA store purchase was largely unsuccessful, so corporate DAZ is not very happy.

Even BadKitteh (Connie) was complaining on Facebook recently about how bad sales are and voicing resentment toward vendors who are happy with "a couple hundred in sales" saying she can't live on that. She was talking about taking a full time job.

They fired Syyd?? So much for their 'friendly merger'.. not that I believed that in the first place, but still..

I think the main problem for BadKitteh is that her products are truly exceptional, there are not many vendors that are on par with her clothing, and making products of that level of quality takes a lot of time and goes for a much higher price. Compared to those who spew out quick and easy skimpwear every week, relatively cheap, quality vendors are bound to lose. In addition, all those quick and cheap products devalues the entire market, as people get used to buying items for practically nothing.

 

[Glitterati3D]

They fired Syyd?? So much for their 'friendly merger'.. not that I believed that in the first place, but still..

Yeah, exact same thoughts here, too.

I think the main problem for BadKitteh is that her products are truly exceptional, there are not many vendors that are on par with her clothing, and making products of that level of quality takes a lot of time and goes for a much higher price. Compared to those who spew out quick and easy skimpwear every week, relatively cheap, quality vendors are bound to lose. In addition, all those quick and cheap products devalues the entire market, as people get used to buying items for practically nothing.

Seeing as how I have never purchased a BadKitteh product (I'm sorry, prices are simply too high) I can't dispute anything you say here. But, frankly, some of these vendors are pricing themselves out of the hobbyist market - yes, I'm talking Stonemason, Aery Soul, BadKitteh, etc. If I DID use DS I wouldn't pay those prices.

 

[tparo]

Sales are way down and several staffers, including Syyd, were fired recently. And DAZ goes through the vendor list annually and culls those vendors who haven't sold enough. On top of that their attempt to bring Poser users back to them with the RDNA store purchase was largely unsuccessful, so corporate DAZ is not very happy.

Even BadKitteh (Connie) was complaining on Facebook recently about how bad sales are and voicing resentment toward vendors who are happy with "a couple hundred in sales" saying she can't live on that. She was talking about taking a full time job.

This is hearsay, and just an excuse to bad mouth Daz and its vendors, I've never heard of this vendor cull you reference nor has anyone I've ever spoken to, the vendors I know speak well of how Daz treat them; honestly you dislike people speculating about Poser's future; and yet you seem so ready to do the same about other companies. And Connie has been ready to badmouth Daz - before it's why she left to go to RDNA.

 

[tparo]

...

Seeing as how I have never purchased a BadKitteh product (I'm sorry, prices are simply too high) I can't dispute anything you say here. But, frankly, some of these vendors are pricing themselves out of the hobbyist market - yes, I'm talking Stonemason, Aery Soul, BadKitteh, etc. If I DID use DS I wouldn't pay those prices.

All those vendors produce really high quality products that are well worth the prices asked, you might not realise it but to produce quality of that kind takes skill talent and time and this often needs to be paid for and all those vendors to my mind give value for money.

 

[Glitterati3D]

This is hearsay, and just an excuse to bad mouth Daz and its vendors, I've never heard of this vendor cull you reference nor has anyone I've ever spoken to, the vendors I know speak well of how Daz treat them; honestly you dislike people speculating about Poser's future; and yet you seem so ready to do the same about other companies. And Connie has been ready to badmouth Daz - before it's why she left to go to RDNA.

I'm sorry, but not one word of that post is heresay.