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phd Photoreal SuperFly support thread

Alisa

HW3D QAV Queen Bee
Staff member
QAV-BEE
Glad to see this thread, and thanks for creating that tutorial, Traci!
 

Glitterati3D

Dances with Bees
Glad to see this thread, and thanks for creating that tutorial, Traci!
Anything to help folks get moving on this lovely tool. I've got a render coming where I have added translucency and velvet to the Hivewire Horse coat. This tool brings that "reach out and touch" piece to the products.
 

Glitterati3D

Dances with Bees
Dreamweaver's Cream horse with phd's Translucency, Velvet and Diamond Dust added to the coat. Translucency, Velvet added to the Forelocks, Mane and tail.
phdHorse.jpg
 

Gadget Girl

Extraordinary
Contributing Artist
So I've started playing around with this and I'm very excited, but lots to figure out. Right now I'm just playing around with a simple plant prop, Lisa's Indian Grass and I have a question. In the node section on Diffuse Color it says:

Important! When the weight of the Translucent component of the surface is not zero, the color of the surface will be the mix of the Glossy Color and the Diffuse Color. For example, the leaves diffuse color should be darker than we usually anticipate, while the translucent color should be brighter. This is because what we usually call “the leaves color” is a mix of the diffuse reflection and the subsurface scattering. The translucency is a simpler way to imitate this in very thin objects. It can sound hard, but usually you will use the same Image Map for the both inputs, or slightly different color corrected versions of the same map. So, when using, it is simply enough.
I added the bold for the part I'm unsure of. Does this mean in the case of someone else's prop I'm converting, I should just plug the image map into the Diffuse Color and Glossy Color (this is what I did, but then the color component went away, so I can either adjust the color or add an image map). But if I was making a material for my own product would the better technique be to create two images maps? If so should the color corrected one go on the Diffuse or the Glossy (or is there no right answer and you just have to try both)?

Just a warning, expect me to pick your brain several times here.
 

phdubrov

Noteworthy
Contributing Artist
:( There is error in manual, I'll contact Alisa.
Should be:
Important! When the weight of the Translucent component of the surface is not zero, the color of the surface will be the mix of the Translucency Color and the Diffuse Color. For example, the leaves diffuse color should be darker than we usually anticipate, while the translucent color should be brighter. This is because what we usually call “the leaves color” is a mix of the diffuse reflection and the subsurface scattering. The translucency is a simpler way to imitate this in very thin objects. It can sound hard, but usually you will use the same Image Map for the both inputs, or slightly different color corrected versions of the same map. So, when using, it is simply enough.

Translucency, not Glossy. DO NOT assign the same color to Diffuse and Glossy unless you work with metal. (see Set up the glossy surfaces).

There is no right answer. Usually 1 image map and 2 HSV nodes for color correction are enough for a plant. Two maps (or three if you work with two sides) can be better, you can add different details on the different maps, but you will need close-up to see the difference.

Just a warning...
It's the reason for this thread existence :)
 

Gadget Girl

Extraordinary
Contributing Artist
Thanks for the quick response. That makes a lot more sense to me, which almost makes me think I'm starting to get the hang of the material room.

In the mean time, I decided to play around with something more complex, hair, and I found something that I just think is the coolest thing ever. You see I have this hair I was to use for a thief character I'm working on in a render. I hooked up the basic maps then started playing with some of the other settings to what would happen when working with hair.

(A couple quick notes on the renders, they are all done in SF with the very fast preview settings, so they are not baked enough by any stretch of the imagination. Secondly the only part I've changed so far is the center 'stripe' that is pulled back. Everything else is the original FF material the hair came with. On that note I should say this hair is designed so you can color the center front differently than the rest, which I've done here for my character. The main part of the hair is dark brown, and the front center stripe and whips are set to be black).

Anyway. . . Here's the hair when I'd done nothing but plug in the image maps. In this I was using the default roughness of .1

Not bad at all, the center is starting to look pretty good, definitely better that the unconverted parts. Then I set the roughness to .3

And OMG! I can't tell you how happy that makes me. The hair isn't supper glossy like my character brushes her hair 100 times every day both before and after she goes to bed. Like I said, this is supposed to be a their character, I want her to be a little rough, but her hair pulled out of her face, hence this choice in hair.

Finally, I set the roughness up to .5

So I haven't decided, but this might be further than I want to go. But this excites me so much. I've never known how to get rid of the super glossy supermodel shine that most hairs have. It's great for some characters, but not others. Not to mention the hair is just looking way better in SF to begin with, looks much more like plastic on the parts I haven't gotten to yet.

Anyway, my point is I'm super excited, that I now have new ways to adjust these materials for my characters.
 

Carey

Extraordinary
I did a quick tutorial on how I made the changes to the apartment backdrop.
This may help some of you. Of course, I did some things wrong in it - or could have done them differently - but it's a quick start to using these fabulous resources!
Dropbox - SuperflyPhotorealMiniTutorial.pdf
crap, okay first I would like to say thanks ever so much for this tutorial, but as usual too much is assumed. the simple words like "select all" select all what, where to I find this select all and copy...see your already assuming that the base knowledge of the person is beyond beginner level or in my case pain killer induced semi coma...lol also you provide no picture of the the end results or step by step results.. great effort though and sending love and kisses for you even making the attempt.. Yes, I am not your normal run of the mill poser user and after buying this product it didn't take long to realize that learning this product was like learning poser all over again. We won't discuss how many years it took me to get to the skill level I am presently at with poser, nor will we mention just how much I still don't know about poser...lol

Thanks for this tutorial, please may I have more?
 

Glitterati3D

Dances with Bees
The second image is the finished result.

Select All is a basic Advanced Material Room command. Right click.

You're welcome, I guess. Hard to tell if you got anything from the tutorial.

I am certainly no material room guru by any stretch of the imagination, and find as many shortcuts as I can. The less time I have to spend in there, the less possibility there is of my truly screwing something up.

Right click>Select All>Apply to All is my favorite command in the Advanced Material Room. Set up the material once and spread it all around. Then skeddale out. LOL!
 

Glitterati3D

Dances with Bees
In the advanced Material Room, right clicking on the Surface Name will bring up a submenu allowing you to select all the materials currently in the room.

Then, another click on that submenu will allow you to apply those materials to every material node in the object.
SelectAllMaterialRoom.jpg
 

Carey

Extraordinary
Okay time to come clean, I loved your tutorial and the reason why is the pdf for this is a whole bunch of words and not many pictures, I need a comic book....lol seriously I do, give me a few words and lots of pics, you know (Blue Prints) and I can work my way and get my head wrapped around something new...you did throw me a loop and I thank you very much for your kind treatment of the feeble minded by replying to me...
 

ribroast

New-Bee
Not much activity here at the moment I see. I recently converted some FF shaders for a bunch of robot figures from FF to SF and I am really happy with the results. I've used the Photoreal shader to make quite a few materials for my own models from scratch and it really is easier than making a good Firefly shader I think. I was never an advanced Firefly user to begin with. I am loving these shaders and I think I am getting along pretty well with them, but I don't have a clue how to use those HSV clamped nodes. I understand how to use a single HSV (Hue, Saturation, Value) but the double and triple ones make me wonder. I also understand the significance of the node being clamped. I recently bought Xfrog to make my own trees and plants so I am currently making materials for Xfrog plants. I am just getting into double sided materials and translucent/velvety nodes for the first time. This brought my attention to the HSV nodes, and I read somewhere that their use is critical for stuff like leaves. Any guidance on the proper use of the HSV nodes would be greatly appreciated. Also, are these HSV nodes HSV, HSV2 (Firefly) or cycles HSV nodes with the clamp added? Thanks!
 

Alisa

HW3D QAV Queen Bee
Staff member
QAV-BEE
Don't have answers, hopefully phd will chime in, ribroast but welcome to the HW Forums!
 

phdubrov

Noteworthy
Contributing Artist
I understand how to use a single HSV (Hue, Saturation, Value) but the double and triple ones make me wonder. I also understand the significance of the node being clamped. I recently bought Xfrog to make my own trees and plants so I am currently making materials for Xfrog plants. I am just getting into double sided materials and translucent/velvety nodes for the first time. This brought my attention to the HSV nodes, and I read somewhere that their use is critical for stuff like leaves. Any guidance on the proper use of the HSV nodes would be greatly appreciated. Also, are these HSV nodes HSV, HSV2 (Firefly) or cycles HSV nodes with the clamp added? Thanks!
Welcome here!
Node groups are made of Cycles HSV nodes.
They are not critical per se. You can use any color correction nodes that you like. Provided node groups just make it easier when you have only one starting color texture IMO.
The critical part is to have different (slightly or dramatically) colors for the sides of the leaves. And have translucency with slightly different color also. Like in real life.
 

ribroast

New-Bee
Thanks phdubrov for your reply. The HSV nodes are becoming a little more clear to me after playing with them some more today. I was having trouble wrapping my head around them partly because I was thinking the HSV x 3 nodes where wired in series, and that made no sense. After another look I realize they are not in series. Also, I stated that I understood the significance of them being clamped, but I only understood that their range was clamped from 0 -1. I was still a bit confused today when setting them to 1 made my leaves purple, I was expecting them to act like a un-clamped node where a setting of 1 would leave the color unchanged. So now I know that a setting of .5 on those nodes leaves the color unchanged. A setting of 1.0 is at the extreme end of the nodes range, duh. If I could pick your brain one more time, roughness settings, on page 31 of the manual "roughness from 0.05 to 0.25 for the common dielectric. This is the most common range." If this is true my understanding of roughness in cycles is way off. I set roughness closer to 1.0 (like 0.875) for dirt or concrete and about 0.0 for a mirror. I guess I would expect a leaf to be around 0.25 or more. I have used the product to make quite a few materials that are like a painted , cruddy wall, or rusty pipes for sci-fi interiors and I think they look great, but maybe I need to adjust those and they could be better. And I have yet to tackle those Velvet settings. For my tree I won't need to get too fancy since I can't imagine needing a very close up render. The tree is sized like a large birch tree, so the branches are over the heads of a Poser figure. In fact I am not putting specular or normal maps on the leaves even. I will get more fancy when I get to my dandelion's, of which I have already made models of a flowered one and one with a puff ball on top. These where the first models I made with Xfrog when I was learning how to use the software. I will most likely put them fairly close to the camera in a scene.
2sideTest01.png
treeTest05.jpg
Dandylion_01_001.jpg
matnodes02.jpg


If you could, please inspect my shader tree and point out any irregularities. I added a gamma math node after the transparency map but this is pretty much where I'm at for now. I am going to make some billboard planes, one with the normals facing away, to test shaders on. It's hard to see what's going on with the tree's leaves. Thanks- AEC
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