realistic Armor for females

[Desertsilver]

Just my 2 cents from being an x Olympic athlete trainer, and looking at the differences between male and females in intensive training- the majority of men, if given the same workout as a woman, will be much, much, stronger and more nimble.

That full set of plate armor was extremely heavy and bulky. I could be wrong, but don't believe that most women would be able to fight a male warrior in it and win. Boiled leather and chain- that's more likely.

So I totally get your point about 'bikini' armor, but I consider most female armor as just plain fantasy anyway. ( and I love fantasy!)

It's interesting that the Daz store does( did?) have a pretty realistic female set with no indented ' boob plate'.

I've never seen it used in a single render, anywhere... looks a bit like the tin man from the wizard of Oz...

 

[NapalmArsenal]

No to the boob plate, but yes to the cuirass I would say. At least that way your front and back for that matter are covered! hehe as from experience =) not all your opponents are going to attack from the front in melee combat.

My favourite is probably Vallejo, but I've always considered this one by Royo one of the best fantasy images ever...
It's called "The Wings of Reflection" and is seen at its best in the actual portrait proportions, though
http://www.dana-mad.ru/gal/display.php?img=1836

Thanks for the link! Yes it's one of my all time favorites of his. I also like the one called Howls of Silence, but it's a little riske to post here and The Pendulum's Calm!

 

[NapalmArsenal]

Little kind of topic. I totelly hate it when playing games that when ever I pick a female character warrior. She is dressed in those darn plate bikinis. Dammit I too want full body armor. If I would ever fight dragons and demons (or anything that require me to fight with my life at risk) no F*** way I would only wear plate bikini - no I would wear full armor set.

Well True LOL, but then again I think of it as this............. I will mesmerize you with my beauty like a cobra ready to strike and once your are rightly hypnotized then I'll run my sword right through your breadbox and you won't even feel a thing.

To quote Riddick it's been along time since I've smelled beautiful.

 

[NapalmArsenal]

Just my 2 cents from being an x Olympic athlete trainer, and looking at the differences between male and females in intensive training- the majority of men, if given the same workout as a woman, will be much, much, stronger and more nimble.

That full set of plate armor was extremely heavy and bulky. I could be wrong, but don't believe that most women would be able to fight a male warrior in it and win. Boiled leather and chain- that's more likely.

So I totally get your point about 'bikini' armor, but I consider most female armor as just plain fantasy anyway. ( and I love fantasy!)

It's interesting that the Daz store does( did?) have a pretty realistic female set with no indented ' boob plate'.

I've never seen it used in a single render, anywhere... looks a bit like the tin man from the wizard of Oz...

Dunno, I've had quite a few men cringe when in combat situations RLOF then again I am 6'2" and taller than most of them and use a bastard sword!

 

[Gadget Girl]

Women did fight, but they generally had to pretend to be men to do so. Those we know about were those who were ultimately UNsuccessful in maintaining their cover as men; there may have been others who were never unmasked (un-trousered?). The Knights Templar had a rule that all members of the order had to grow beards. You could read something between the lines on that one!

That was certainly true once we get to the medieval period (and most fantasy stuff is set in a generic medieval period) but there is some evidence of celtic women fighting, and we don't have any reason to think they were forced to dress as men. In fact the great Irish hero Cúchulainn was trained by a woman, who was considered to be one of the greatest fighters. Now, the people who make bikini armor, would also put her in bikini armor, rather than some form of leather armor which is more likely what she would have worn.

That full set of plate armor was extremely heavy and bulky. I could be wrong, but don't believe that most women would be able to fight a male warrior in it and win. Boiled leather and chain- that's more likely.

You're completely right that plate mail was very heavy and bulky. It was also extremely expensive, which meant you had to have a lot of money to own it, and. . . that also meant you had enough money to own a horse. Plate mail was mostly designed for heavy cavalry. That doesn't mean no one ever fought on foot in it, but the idea was to have the horse help you out with a lot of the heavy lifting.

And that also brings up an interesting science question. It takes a lot of metal to create a full suit of plate mail for a big guy, which is why it's so heavy. But, if you were custom making armor for a small woman (and many sets were custom made, at least among the wealthiest), you would need less metal, so it would be less heavy. Of course the smaller woman is also not going to have the same level of strength as the bigger man. . . There's an equation in there somewhere having to do with the surface area of skin in relation to muscle mass. I'm not sure if the need for less metal actual compensates for less strength in a smaller woman but. . . who knows?

And there is one other theoretical consideration. Woman are certainly on average weaker than men, but on average have better endurance. In a long battle (vs. a shorter one on one combat) a woman might start out at a disadvantage, but 'catch up' as she tiers less quickly.

Of course that's all pure speculation.

 

[jecnodde]

Well True LOL, but then again I think of it as this............. I will mesmerize you with my beauty like a cobra ready to strike and once your are rightly hypnotized then I'll run my sword right through your breadbox and you won't even feel a thing.

To quote Riddick it's been along time since I've smelled beautiful.

Not really sure trolls, dragons, wolfs, snakes, boar and other animal/creature would be very mesmerize by any woman And if dragons and so on do get mesmerize by woman, then its domed against female dragons/creature. I think they just think "Wieee can free food, hate when that plate get stuck in my teeth"

 

[phdubrov]

For on foot tournament. Skirt is necessary part.

 

[jecnodde]

That was certainly true once we get to the medieval period (and most fantasy stuff is set in a generic medieval period) but there is some evidence of celtic women fighting, and we don't have any reason to think they were forced to dress as men. In fact the great Irish hero Cúchulainn was trained by a woman, who was considered to be one of the greatest fighters. Now, the people who make bikini armor, would also put her in bikini armor, rather than some form of leather armor which is more likely what she would have worn.



You're completely right that plate mail was very heavy and bulky. It was also extremely expensive, which meant you had to have a lot of money to own it, and. . . that also meant you had enough money to own a horse. Plate mail was mostly designed for heavy cavalry. That doesn't mean no one ever fought on foot in it, but the idea was to have the horse help you out with a lot of the heavy lifting.

And that also brings up an interesting science question. It takes a lot of metal to create a full suit of plate mail for a big guy, which is why it's so heavy. But, if you were custom making armor for a small woman (and many sets were custom made, at least among the wealthiest), you would need less metal, so it would be less heavy. Of course the smaller woman is also not going to have the same level of strength as the bigger man. . . There's an equation in there somewhere having to do with the surface area of skin in relation to muscle mass. I'm not sure if the need for less metal actual compensates for less strength in a smaller woman but. . . who knows?

And there is one other theoretical consideration. Woman are certainly on average weaker than men, but on average have better endurance. In a long battle (vs. a shorter one on one combat) a woman might start out at a disadvantage, but 'catch up' as she tiers less quickly.

Of course that's all pure speculation.

One more thing to consider is that medival spawn overa long time + diffrent times in diffrent country - so the fashion changes.
I once saw a tv show where elite men either as in navy seal, elite sportmen, you name it. Got to go to the armory museum in england where they keep lots of armory and tradition alive. They got to try the armory, horse riding, bow, dancing.

The poor men had a darn hard time and was so sure that "Ofc medival warrior in armory couldnt move so much" Then the cheif ot the armory museum called for some guys who worked there, who had been training with armory. When they started to fight, it was as they didnt wear any armory at all.

"You see, knights who wear the armory got used to it, their skin hardned where the armory was to close to the body, they got muscles to wear it -they got used to it"


I'm going to see if I can find that show, was darn intresting.

 

[NapalmArsenal]

This one is child sized not sure if it's English or French then again GG there is another factor too. Is women's armor lighter to compensate for less strength?

 

[NapalmArsenal]

Not really sure trolls, dragons, wolfs, snakes, boar and other animal/creature would be very mesmerize by any woman And if dragons and so on do get mesmerize by woman, then its domed against female dragons/creature. I think they just think "Wieee can free food, hate when that plate get stuck in my teeth"

Aye, but the fish is always attracted to the lure that tends to be shiny and pleasingly delicious to it and once it bites it's a bit to late!

Oh there is a great story about a gem set into a set of armor that hypnotized anyone who gazed upon it not sure I remember who it's by though.

If you dance around and maneuver enough even naked, it's a right entrancing dance no matter what the sex or creature.

Fight as the flame not the moth!

 

[JOdel]

I did a project a couple of years ago where I had to illustrate a fantasy series based on the Dragon Age game. Protagonist was the Noble Human female warrior. It was a pain in the butt getting her into halfway believable armor. Even at that I ended up with the stupid boob plate. I ended up kit bashing, for the most part, just to get proper coverage.

 

[HaiGan]

That was certainly true once we get to the medieval period (and most fantasy stuff is set in a generic medieval period) but there is some evidence of celtic women fighting, and we don't have any reason to think they were forced to dress as men

Very true. My focus is the medieval era in Europe, but I should have kept other eras and locations in mind. There are also goddesses from a number of different cultures who have reputations as formidable warriors.

The era of full plate armour of the sort that tends to be represented most in popular media was of very short duration within history as a whole, and used within a relatively small geographical area. More flexible* (*well made plate armour could still allow for a great range of movement) armour covers both a longer timespan and a wider range of cultures. You could also find people wearing a mix of elements such as a leather coat, metal breastplate and a metal skull cap under normal hat- it depends where and when you look as to what would be common. Weight wise a full set of ("chain") mail, including legs, head and hands, is around the same weight as a full set of plate, perhaps more if you include the helmet, depending on the quality of the materials and the construction techniques used. I haven't checked on the weights of scale, banded, or hardened leather.

If we're in the realms of fantasy (or science-fiction), then armour could perhaps look like whatever you want it to, if you have magic applied to it (or Highly Advanced Science involved in its materials and construction) which provides protection from elements and blows. Or you could have intelligent armour that actively moves around to provide protection, either constructed or perhaps a trained animal or familiar. None of which is "realistic" in the slightest in the sense of matching actual historical stuff, but which could be entirely in keeping with the internal logic of the setting.

 

[Dakorillon (IMArts)]

It’s Time to Retire “Boob Plate” Armor. Because It Would Kill You.

Something to consider....

Myself is kind of sick of all "Breast plates, plate bikini - no protection at all - just look sexy" armory that is for the ladies.

That is what Rings of Protection are for.
Add in a Ring or Armring of Comfort to take care of the cold
Maybe a Necklace of Defense
And a Ring or Earring of Regeneration, and you are set to go!
You get the protection, but also throw off the enemy, because you are running around half naked.

 

[NapalmArsenal]

Very true. My focus is the medieval era in Europe, but I should have kept other eras and locations in mind. There are also goddesses from a number of different cultures who have reputations as formidable warriors.

The era of full plate armour of the sort that tends to be represented most in popular media was of very short duration within history as a whole, and used within a relatively small geographical area. More flexible* (*well made plate armour could still allow for a great range of movement) armour covers both a longer timespan and a wider range of cultures. You could also find people wearing a mix of elements such as a leather coat, metal breastplate and a metal skull cap under normal hat- it depends where and when you look as to what would be common. Weight wise a full set of ("chain") mail, including legs, head and hands, is around the same weight as a full set of plate, perhaps more if you include the helmet, depending on the quality of the materials and the construction techniques used. I haven't checked on the weights of scale, banded, or hardened leather.

If we're in the realms of fantasy (or science-fiction), then armour could perhaps look like whatever you want it to, if you have magic applied to it (or Highly Advanced Science involved in its materials and construction) which provides protection from elements and blows. Or you could have intelligent armour that actively moves around to provide protection, either constructed or perhaps a trained animal or familiar. None of which is "realistic" in the slightest in the sense of matching actual historical stuff, but which could be entirely in keeping with the internal logic of the setting.

Very true with the location and time periods and the Chinese actually used paper and silk armor. With the development of the bodkin tipped arrow most of the plate mail types became ineffective and even more so with the creation of the flintlock pistols. And eventually it was reduced to just the breast plate and helmet as per your conquistadors. Although, many military units today still use body armor.

Then of course there is your shield of missile protection and your gauntlets of deafening, etc and the list goes on for all the DND wear you can think of. +3 mug of bludgeoning + added effect to summon an efreet once a blue moon.

 

[Dakorillon (IMArts)]

LOVE Luis Royo !! He has a way of playing with light and shadows that is astounding ! He also is really big with the beautiful and the beastly in his art work!
Yes, also a fan of Anne Stokes, Nene Thomas fairies, horses, elves,dragons, Ruth Thompson dragons, fairies, and horses, Victoria Francis Gothic/Vampires, Larry Elmore dragons and RPG characters, and Olivia for your pinups.
Royo

Love all those! And there were a couple of older artists, that did amazing fantasy work, Christopher Achilleos, and the Brothers who did the Hobbit art, was back. Melody Pena for unicorns and horses, Dragon, CatDraks, She does mostly sculpture, now.

 

[HaiGan]

Getting back to the original question, what SORT(s) of realistic, good-coverage armour would people like to see? What era, what geographical location or culture? Most of my art is fantasy, but I can appreciate a good reproduction of an actual historical set (or, more commonly, wince at the other sort). Mix-and-match is good: make the base something that could be used in a historical render, such as a padded aketon and basic mail shirt over it, a mail coif and plain helmet, then have elements that can be added if the setting is fantasy, such as strapped on vambraces, shoulder guards, helmet morphs and additions, and so on.

I very seldom see (for male OR female characters) sets that include somewhere to keep weaponry when not using it. Axe-rings, baldricks, knife sheaths and so on. They exist, just not in great number. You can find swords with scabbards, but not many armour sets include a means of attaching third party weaponry like that. I like to imagine that the reason there's so much fighting in fantasy settings is because humans and elves never wear scabbards, so they have to carry their swords in their hands all the time, so the nice peaceful goblins and orcs assume that they're about to be attacked and defend themselves accordingly.

 

[Dakorillon (IMArts)]

I very seldom see (for male OR female characters) sets that include somewhere to keep weaponry when not using it. Axe-rings, baldricks, knife sheaths and so on. They exist, just not in great number. You can find swords with scabbards, but not many armour sets include a means of attaching third party weaponry like that. I like to imagine that the reason there's so much fighting in fantasy settings is because humans and elves never wear scabbards, so they have to carry their swords in their hands all the time, so the nice peaceful goblins and orcs assume that they're about to be attacked and defend themselves accordingly.

You made me snort! lol

 

[Gadget Girl]

Got to go to the armory museum in england where they keep lots of armory and tradition alive. They got to try the armory, horse riding, bow, dancing.

Do you mean the one in Leeds? I got to go there many years ago and it was amazing. Also a good example of how many specialized forms of armor there are, as evidence by the pictures people have posted.

Getting back to the original question, what SORT(s) of realistic, good-coverage armour would people like to see?

Well to give an example of a similar style on both men and woman, I do love what Game of Thrones did with the Northmen, and Brienne of Earth:

What I like is the heavier armor for the upper body, but then the studded skirt for the rest (I think gambeson is the correct term). I also think from a 3d perspective there's a lot you could do with a fairly simple base, and good textures.

 

[jecnodde]

Do you mean the one in Leeds? I got to go there many years ago and it was amazing. Also a good example of how many specialized forms of armor there are, as evidence by the pictures people have posted.

Yes I think so. The show on tv is now kind of old I saw it in like 2007- 2008

 

[scatha]

Little kind of topic. I totelly hate it when playing games that when ever I pick a female character warrior. She is dressed in those darn plate bikinis. Dammit I too want full body armor. If I would ever fight dragons and demons (or anything that require me to fight with my life at risk) no F*** way I would only wear plate bikini - no I would wear full armor set.

One of the reasons I enjoyed playing Dragon Age.