Poser sold to Rendo

[carmen indorato]

LOL... about that pic- I had gotten up VERY early this morning to head to the Wild Animal Sanctuary and was not awake at all (I'm more of a night owl) when I saw the orignal post I don't drink coffee either, so let's just say I was a bit shocked and speechless I do think it could turn out to be a very good thing- I do hope they get smart and re-hire the wonderful developers who know it so well and keep it going well. Def a plus for Poser content for sure.

Nice to read Poser has found a newer possibly better supported home. I hope Rendo stops dumping lower sale items that support Mil4 figures so we can still get stuff for Poser. Of late they have been getting more and more stuff (especially in Freestuff) for D/S and Genesis and less and less for Poser. Seems LaFemme will be their central figure since they market it so much and the fact it is a Poser figure I can see them promoting her more and more for their new Poser offering at expense of ny other established figures!
I am concerned because I have written to some of the older Poser Content creators like Stonemason and RAWART and Sixus(who refuses to EVER return to creating Poser content and is quite content creating content exclusively for D/S. Says it is easier to create than for Poser).
If more of the other content creators who migrated from Poser to D/S feel the same way so much for finding existing experienced Poser content creators/support team.

 

[brian foley]

Well I started with poser 2...It was back in the day and I still have the cd...I have been with rendo since early 2000's...
Zygote(aka Daz3D and hivewire3D folks from all three had alot to do with poser back in the day...


Foleypro's Gallery on Renderosity


I am happy poser has found a home...I use poser to rig everything...its easy and fast...DS is fast to but alot of work to get the final product...But with tons more options...But its nice to see great job Rendo....

 

[Mythocentric]

Current confusion aside CI I personally think that Poser's transition to Renderosity is the best possible outcome for Posers future. I think that you are in a similar situation to me as far as content is concerned. I have used Poser for a long time and over the years, I have purchased an awful lot of content. That has it's downside in many ways in as far as finding new content becomes harder to find for the simple reason that I have already bought most of what is available as far as my particular interest is concerned. There are however content creators old and new producing content for Poser. For example, Jack Tomelin (over at Daz) and Merlin are both notable for quality. In fact, I was recently able to save myself over $98 on JT products after my daughter pointed me to a 50% off sale he had. Elsewhere too there are new vendors coming up and Rendo recently featured some of them as being noteworthy. Then, of course, there is Hivewire who I would hold up to anyone for their quality and unique output. My only concern is in the range of clothing for our characters and the preponderance of slut/skimp wear out there. V4 is encumbered by vast amounts of the stuff and unfortunately LaFemme is falling to the same dilemma and I would ask those content creators if they really believe that a figure needs to be constantly presented in garments which barely cover her groin (if that) or would it not benefit the market if they looked into the other periods for clothing which there have been many throughout history. Again, I would cite LaFemme whose sole garment of any note from history is one medieval dress. Yes! One and I bought it which effectively removes LaFemme from any image I might come up with which is anything other than current fashion. Its a simple equation: Lack of product I'm looking for = no purchase = lost sale opportunity. That doesn't help anyone and hopefully its something Rendo can address in future. As for those content creators who have left Poser, including one notable for their unfortunate virilence on the subject I have to ask myself, what sort of response would they receive from a staunch Poser support base notable for its long memory. Some, of course, would be most welcome whilst others perhaps would be wiser to remain a thing of the past! Regards!

 

[Ken1171]

Wow, I an a little late in this thread, and I wish I could say I was surprised - I am instead a little relieved. The long silence and suspense from SMS was killing me.

In spite of how it was marketed, Poser 11 always had a single version. Debut and Pro versions are just a matter of locking/unlocking features with different serial numbers, but it's still the same program. It's just a marketing strategy to justify selling the SAME program for higher or lower prices. Having that said, whether Rendo claims to have acquired "Poser 11" or "Poser 11 Pro", it's the same thing software-wise. In practice, if you have Poser 11, you already have Poser 11 Pro with some features disabled or not visible in the interface. Like Glitterati3D has said above, an "upgrade" from Standard to Pro wouldn't even require a download of anything - you already have the Pro version. The new serial number will unlock the missing features, and that's all.

Like some others here, I have seen Poser being passed ownership from one company to the next so many times that it becomes hard to keep track of it. Poser has advanced quite a bit with SMS, but some decisions they made were less than stellar, starting with Poser 11 Pro being overpriced, the Standard version not being able to copy morphs, and the insistence of adding new flashy features instead of fixing the things that were broken. We ended up with lots of new features built over the same-old bugs that were being perpetuated to the next versions. That makes sense, SMS being a software retailer. They have prioritized the marketing value (shiny new features) over quality (fixing the old bugs). I can only hope this will be different with Rendo, because they understand this market and know who their public is - as opposed to how it was with SMS. The fact that Rendo has lowered the price is an indication that they indeed know who we are. That is a relief.

Honestly, I don't care so much for a version 12 as much as I care for having the rather SERIOUS issues that have plagued Poser for decades. Perhaps the major one being its inability to support Unimesh geometry internally, which results into breaking all geometry exported from Poser. As a consequence, morph targets we export from Poser cannot be used anywhere, because the vertex count is different from the original from the Geometries folder. This was also the reason why Reallusion has failed to support Poser exports - the exported geometry is incompatible with the original. This has a series of bad consequences in content creation, like Poser's built-in Morphing Brush being incompatible with non-Unimesh geometry, which causes the "Smoothing" brush to spike out the model when correcting JCMs. Lady Little Fox has written a whole page of such things to justify why she had abandoned Poser content creation, because those things can indeed break your workflow. I know she's right because it has happened to me, too.

Nonetheless, I have discussed this with Larry Weinberg, the guy who has originally created Poser, and he said they would have to rewrite Poser from scratch, because that's how the core of the program was designed to work, where changing that would affect (break) everything else. I have shown him my broken models, and he understood how serious the situation was for content creators. When Poser 11 SR-5 was released, he made an effort to at least make it possible to fix JCMs using the Morphing Tool by adding a "workaround". It was not a fix, but a way to make that part of the process possible without destroying my models. I remember being stuck for months until Larry and his team gave me a partial solution back in 2016. He said this could be fixed in Poser 12, but he didn't make any promises. I understood a change of that magnitude may not be allowed by SMS, who was more concerned with adding new shiny features that look good on marketing ads.

We have yet to see if Rendo will fix things, or just add new features on top of the old broken shell. In good part, I believe Poser has been losing content creators because of this, plus the mainstream figure wars between bickering companies. Attracting more content creators to the Poser side means getting it fixed, which according to the guy who created it, would require re-writing the code from scratch. Would Rendo be willing to do it?

 

[DanaTA]

I showed Jenn the thread here and told her people were wondering if they bought all versions of Poser and were they going to develop it. Here's what she replied back:




We purchased ALL versions of Poser. We are the only owners of any Poser Software going forward.

We are only going to broker Poser Pro 11 only and price that at the low price of Poser 11 so that EVERYONE can have full access to Poser 11 and Poser 11 Pro. So everyone can use the same great piece of software.

Jenn

So I was right! They're going Pro only, but still charge for it...just not as much.

Dana

 

[Deleted member 325]

@Mythocentric From what I can tell you are not asking Renderosity marketplace for support or haven't sent emails as I doubt they would give different answers to me than you. You are posting in Hivewire3D forums about Renderosity being evasive or something being up. Meanwhile I am going back and forth between here and Jen Blake and posting the answers I get to try to help - and that is still shouted down as not good enough as it's not coming from Renderosity.

I am done. I am out. This is exactly the sort of nonsense I have had enough of from the hobbyist 3D community. This is why I almost never post or try to help anymore. This is why I voluntarily left the Poser Ambassador Program years ago when RDNA fell.

Good luck to all.

 

[Mythocentric]

@Mythocentric From what I can tell you are not asking Renderosity marketplace for support or haven't sent emails as I doubt they would give different answers to me than you. You are posting in Hivewire3D forums about Renderosity being evasive or something being up. Meanwhile, I am going back and forth between here and Jen Blake and posting the answers I get to try to help - and that is still shouted down as not good enough as it's not coming from Renderosity.

I am done. I am out. This is exactly the sort of nonsense I have had enough of from the hobbyist 3D community. This is why I almost never post or try to help anymore. This is why I voluntarily left the Poser Ambassador Program years ago when RDNA fell.

Good luck to all.

1 'From what I can tell you are not asking Renderosity marketplace for support or haven't sent emails as I doubt they would give different answers to me than you.' Wrong! If you had read my posts as thoroughly as you should do you would be aware that I have a support ticket in regarding this matter. Which brings me to your second point.
2 'You are posting in Hivewire3D forums about Renderosity being evasive or something being up.' Wrong! I am posting in Hivewire and Renderosity. That's how I know that Jenn Blakes post could be construed as evasive because it was clear at the time that the product page did not include Poser 11. The very fact that the product page has been changed to now include Poser 11 reinforces that fact. If you had read the posts at Renderosity you would have been aware of that! You would also have been aware that I am not the only one who has raised this issue. Why are you not?
3 'Meanwhile I am going back and forth between here and Jen Blake and posting the answers I get to try to help - and that is still shouted down as not good enough as it's not coming from Renderosity.' May I ask who appointed you to that position? While it may be a laudable attempt on your behalf please do not assume that makes you the go-to authority. Everyone posting in this forum is more than capable of acting on their own behalf without a self-appointed champion running interference. The responsibility for that rests entirely upon your own shoulders and you alone bear the responsibility for someone disagreeing with you!

I would further add that Jenn Blake has responded by pointing us in the direction of the new product page which includes Poser 11. An apt if slightly belated response but it does demonstrate Jenn's willingness to assist. Unfortunately, the purchase link on that page has a bug which results in the licence number you input being rejected. As a solution, you (again of your own volition) pointed us in the direction of the second link which is for non-members (of Renderosity) to take advantage of that purchase offer. As an act of good faith and in order to research your suggestion (something I take very seriously before posting), I took your advice, used it, based on your suggestion and put $99 of my own money where my mouth is and purchased the upgrade. So far I have received a receipt from Renderosity, one from Paypal and been informed that completion of the purchase will take up to 48 hours after receipt of payment. I will keep this thread informed of progress should any other non-member (of Renderosity) wish to take advantage of the offer. My only thought is whether or not that purchase will show in the account I already hold with them. Incidentally, to take advantage of that upgrade offer you will still need to input your current licence number, otherwise, you will be required to pay the full $199 although I think anyone will admit that is a much more attractive price than the previous one!

 

[Mythocentric]

And a quick update:



I have just received an email from Jenn Blake listing my Poser 11 Pro licence/serial number in addition to serial numbers for Queue Manager, Poser Fusion 11 Cinema 4D, Poser Fusion 11 LightWave, Poser Fusion 11 MAX, and Poser Fusion 11 MAYA together with a link for the Download Manager.

However, the email also includes an invitation to become a member of Renderosity so I think it's safe to assume my purchase won’t show in my account which is something I’ll have to clarify with Jenn.

Approximately 5 hours from purchase to delivery (plus download time, of course, but I definitely won’t be pulling an all-nighter like I did last time) but it does demonstrate the importance of adequate research in advance. Hopefully, the bug in the direct link will be sorted just as quickly. Regards.

 

[Miss B]

However, the email also includes an invitation to become a member of Renderosity so I think it's safe to assume my purchase won’t show in my account which is something I’ll have to clarify with Jenn.

If you HAVE an account there, any purchase will show up in your account, as that's how you get the downloads of products you buy from the store. That said, of course, the software is another story altogether, because you access it with the Download Manager, so it may not show up. I should check mine, but I know I purchased P7 from Content Paradise and, IIRC, that's how I purchased P9 as well. Those always showed up in my CP account, but not in my R'osity account.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I assume the "invitation" is to join the R'osity forums, or have you never purchased anything from their store before, in which case "joining" may mean signing up for access to Poser related content in the store.

In any case, glad to hear you got the information you need to get your downloads.

 

[Mythocentric]

Hi Miss B,

As I mentioned above the link I used was the one suggested and is for non-members (of Renderosity). I assume from that that my making my purchase via that link would mean that my purchase would not show up in my account. I'll check and confirm that tomorrow for the simple reason that I am halfway to unconciousness at this time of the morning and I just can't be bothered. I have been a member of Renderosity for a long time, about nine years plus and both my previous Poser software purchases were listed in my account, so I also take it that my purchase via that non-members link means that it will be counted as a 'one-off' This is the relevent line from Jenn's email:

A FREE Membership is required to post in forums and watch tutorials or make purchases. But sign-up is easy and completely FREE. We also have art galleries, a FREESTUFF section as well. You can find our FREESTUFF area here:

In addition to the freestuff, the email also provides links to a range of Poser tutorials. So for the moment I am off to spread the zedds for a few hours. Night all!

 

[Janet]

Hmmm where would Poser show up in your Renderosity account? I just searched my purchases but didn't see it.

 

[Miss B]

I have been a member of Renderosity for a long time, about nine years plus and both my previous Poser software purchases were listed in my account, so I also take it that my purchase via that non-members link means that it will be counted as a 'one-off'

Ahhhh, OK. That makes sense.

 

[Miss B]

Hmmm where would Poser show up in your Renderosity account? I just searched my purchases but didn't see it.

Not sure, but as Mytho just mentioned, because of that "non-members" link, it may not show up in your purchases. I've never purchased Poser software there, so it's not in mine.

 

[skylab]

I just checked mine to help Janet, and it was the first thing I saw in my purchases, being the most recent thing that I bought, so I didn't have to make any effort to search for it. Also, an older version of Poser (with license displayed), a former purchase, also shows up along with the Poser Pro 11 upgrade (with license displayed) when I search through "purchased items". Just thought this might help Janet know what "should" be showing, to help iron out the wrinkles. In neither case were either of my purchases an upgrade from Poser 11...I used an old purchase of a Poser Debut license in order to purchase the Poser Pro 11 upgrade.

 

[skylab]

...and it may be helpful to know that the Poser Debut purchase was made years ago at Content Paradise. When I clicked through the eligibility check at the beginning of the purchase, it recognized my old serial from CP, and proceeded to the next step. That's the reason I was referring to it as a "handshake"...somewhere, somehow there had to be shared information in order for that to successfully function. Hope you can get this fully resolved, Janet...hang in there

 

[Janet]

I'm sure they will get it worked out. Poser is running good at this point. Fingers crossed.

 

[Sempie]

I had the odd feeling they were trying to cover up the very existence of standard Poser 11, by not mentioning it in any way. Apart from the official announcement they made later on, none of the posts inquiring about it were ever directly answered. There was then, with a full day's delay, a statement pretending the upgrade option from regular Poser 11 had always been there, indirectly suggesting we've all been blind. Whatever policy is behind that; I think it is a bit strange. Apart from total newbies, everyone knew about regular Poser 11, especially those who, like me, had actually bought that version.

 

[phdubrov]

Hmmm where would Poser show up in your Renderosity account? I just searched my purchases but didn't see it.

I see it both in Orders and Purchased Items, but only versions that I bought from Rendo, not the ones I bought via CP or SM sites.

 

[Hornet3d]

@Mythocentric From what I can tell you are not asking Renderosity marketplace for support or haven't sent emails as I doubt they would give different answers to me than you. You are posting in Hivewire3D forums about Renderosity being evasive or something being up. Meanwhile I am going back and forth between here and Jen Blake and posting the answers I get to try to help - and that is still shouted down as not good enough as it's not coming from Renderosity.

I am done. I am out. This is exactly the sort of nonsense I have had enough of from the hobbyist 3D community. This is why I almost never post or try to help anymore. This is why I voluntarily left the Poser Ambassador Program years ago when RDNA fell.

Good luck to all.

I really do hope you reconsider your decision, I have valued your input and you have helped me on numerous occasions over the past few years so I personally would miss your input. I doubt that I am alone so your absence would be a loss to the 3D art community in general. This sort of thread is always a difficult one in that it will mean big changes for passionate Poser users in the long run. I think it is fair to say that for many there is a feeling that, as Poser users, we have been playing second fiddle to DS in for some time thanks to the loss of vendors and the lack of any real development. I know it is only a piece of software but for many it is a escape from an otherwise horrible and seemingly unfair world. Even if this is not the case many, myself included, have invested a lot of time and vast amounts of money to Poser, which one reason why we are passionate about it. I have been using Poser for close on twenty years and, not only do I not have the money, at my age, I probably do not have the time to learn any piece of software to the same skill level.

I can well understand the frustration of someone who has wished to be able to have the use of Poser Pro, but not being able to afford it, if they see a opportunity they to buy it at a price they can afford and then to be let down during the checkout process. I know because I have been there when I tried numerous time to upgrade to Poser 11 Pro at an advertised price only to have 20% tax added because I live in the UK. I finally purchased it at a stunning price after about three years but I still remember the disappointment.

It is easy look into the future and see nothing but gloom without looking back at the past. I do know that Poser is difficult for vendors because so many have said so but as I user SM gave me Sub Surface Scattering, the morph brush, the fitting room, and Superfly, that alone makes me very happy and there were many more pluses (they also gave me the deactivation feature so it was not all roses). I love using the software but that does not stop me wanting more, just like I love using Dawn SE but the thought of Dawn 2 excites me, but for all that I will be happy just to see Poser move rather than stagnant. It has been suggested in this thread that Rendo should concentrate on fixing the problems rather then add features and, while I expect this will not be the case as they want to make money from their new purchase, I would be happy with that just because Poser was moving forward.

I love using Poser 11 Pro and I would be very happy if all Poser users could use Poser 11 pro. I personally would not be at all unhappy if people got the upgrade for free even though I paid for it mainly because all poser users would benefit in the long run.

One heart felt plea to finish, please can we all take a step back, this change may well turn out to be the best news for Poser in a long while, but it also provides the opportunity to open up wounds and cause new harm. That was partially what I was referring to when I mentioned my concerns earlier that old well tread paths such as Genesis working in Poser being started all over again. That is a very small step way repeating earlier mistakes that did damage to the wider 3D art community, so much so that we are still suffering from it today.

 

[Miss B]

I see it both in Orders and Purchased Items, but only versions that I bought from Rendo, not the ones I bought via CP or SM sites.

That's what I suspected as well, as I mentioned earlier, I got P7 and P9 through CP, and eventually PP11 through SmithMicro, so I really didn't expect to see those purchases in my R'osity account. Of course, going forward that will change.